Madinat al-Muslimeen Islamic Message Board
| Need HELP with site! |
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| proudtobemuslim |
| 09/02/00 at 09:00:31 |
| Assalam-u-Alaikum, I have been working on a site of mine for quite some time now and have got everything in place... except the articles! I have emailed many sites such as Salafipublications.com for permission to use a couple of their articles (just on the basics and tenents of faith such as tawheed) but none have replied. I've noticed many of you have your own websites so I was wondering if someone could please help me and inform me on what to do! Jannah, Arshad?! Believe me when I say that this is a last resort. I would appreciate any comments and suggestions from anyone in any manner. P.S. and how do i know if an article is in the free domain? Wassalam-u-Alaikum. |
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| bhaloo |
| 09/03/00 at 11:32:49 |
| Asalaam alaikum wrt wb, I don't think there should be a problem if you include the article and who wrote it. That's typically what I do. |
| Re: Need HELP with site! |
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| proudtobemuslim |
| 09/04/00 at 06:19:00 |
| Assalam-u-Alaikum, If the article is copyrighted then you must have the author's permission to use it on your site... even if you include the author's name and that you didn't write it (you have to do that even if you get permission). See www.whatiscopyright.org for more information. |
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| chachi |
| 09/07/00 at 19:13:02 |
hmm theres different copyright laws in different countries general rule is you can copy unless it says copyright or rights reserved etc if copyright exists then ask via email or phone (get name of person) and if nobody answers you could cut and paste the article giving authors name and saying at the bottom that you have tried to trace the author and to please contact you if they disagree with what your doing . That should be sufficient 10% of the article is acceptable in any case for the purposes of review |
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| proudtobemuslim |
| 09/11/00 at 05:57:36 |
| Assalam-u-Alaikum, Thanks for your help, chachi. But some of what you say goes against what I read about copyright in web magazines and the above mentioned URL. How much of a difference is there in copyright law in different countries? In the jannah.org FAQ, Jannah says that all the articles she has are either in the free domain or sher has permission to print them. How do I know if an article is in the free domain? I wouldn't mind seeing a few words from Jannah. Yes, I wouldn't mind at all. In fact, I'd look forward it. YES, TRULY... Wassalam-u-Alaikum |
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| haaris |
| 09/11/00 at 07:51:55 |
| Asalaamu aleikoum Chachi: make sure you do an IP seat during your training contract!! The general rule (although it varies from country to country) is that you CANNOT copy something without the permission of the author or copyright holder. Just because something is on the web does not mean that you can copy it to put on your own web site. Copyright is (as its name suggests) the right to prevent others from copying your work. It accrues in the first instance to the person who wrote it and it accrues AUTOMATICALLY so you do not need to register it (unlike, for example, a patent, which has no real effect until registered) or say "all rights reserved". People only tend to put phrases like "all rights reserved" or "(c) Whoever Limited 2000" because it enables them to get better damages from villains when they take them to court (it helps establish some kind of bad faith on the part of the villain). However, it is not generally considered a breach of copyright to put a link from one web site to another. Let me know if you're based in the UK and need any other legal pointers. Salaam Haaris |
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| jannah |
| 09/11/00 at 12:31:26 |
| walaikum salaam wrt, in the "free-domain ", i consider those articles where the author has said "you can use it, forward it, send it to others, etc" basically they say anyone can use the article and they might specify some conditions like it not being modified in any way other articles i had to seek permission from the authors like the jamal badawi book or the khutbahs by muhammad shareef etc... [quote]Assalam-u-Alaikum, Thanks for your help, chachi. But some of what you say goes against what I read about copyright in web magazines and the above mentioned URL. How much of a difference is there in copyright law in different countries? In the jannah.org FAQ, Jannah says that all the articles she has are either in the free domain or sher has permission to print them. How do I know if an article is in the free domain? I wouldn't mind seeing a few words from Jannah. Yes, I wouldn't mind at all. In fact, I'd look forward it. YES, TRULY... Wassalam-u-Alaikum [/quote] |
| Re: Need HELP with site! |
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| chachi |
| 09/14/00 at 18:58:39 |
salaam let me repeat ...have you heard of the berne convention akhi? so far only 96 countries have signed it, which dosn't include iran so far as i'm aware and incidentally i didn't realise that the uk still ruled the world... next let me see ...lets quote some american law now "Fair Use See 17 United States Code Section 107- Limitations on Exclusive Rights: Fair Use- For certain purposes, such as criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching (including multiple copies for classroom use), scholarship or research, is not an infringement of copyright. In making this determination of fair use these 4 factors must be considered: purpose and character of use, whether of a commercial nature or for nonprofit educational purposes; the nature of the copyrighted work; the amount and substantiality of the portion used in relation to the copyrighted work as a whole; and the effect of the use upon the potential market for or value of the copyrighted work. " so as you can see your definition is somewhat limited akhi... secondly and surely you know about policy issues in law...do you really believe that afghanistan, or iran or any other muslim country will afford copyright protection to a article or product which they believe is offensive? |
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| chachi |
| 09/14/00 at 19:20:55 |
Ok this is the final article on it...note what he says 'For Most Countries.....' Copyright Clearance, Protection and Enforcement Outside of the United States Comments are generalizations and may not apply to every situation. It is advisable to consult with a competent professional before relying on any written commentary. Paul D. Supnik is a member of the State Bar of California and not of any other state or country. The material set forth herein is not for the purpose of soliciting any engagements where to do so would be to offend or violate the professional standards of any other state, country or bar. Copyright 1996 by Paul D. Supnik For most countries, copyright requires no formality to become effective. Most countries do not require any copyright notice. However, one treaty, the Universal Copyright Convention provided protection for works published with a three part copyright notice, the ©, the name of the copyright proprietor and the year of first publication. The importance of this treaty is now reduced, but not eliminated as a result of the United States joining the Berne convention. Works which are in the public domain in the United States may not be in the public domain outside of the United States. And works which may have been in the public domain may no longer be in the public domain as a result of copyright restoration. The United States is a party to various copyright treaties which provide a method for enforcing copyright of United States origin abroad. The Berne convention provides that its members must recognize copyright in member countries as they do for nationals of their country, without formalities. Thus, member countries may not require as a condition of copyright, that the work be registered or that the work bear a copyright notice. However, the United States was the countries that had imposed those requirements in recent years prior to the adherence to Berne. The Berne convention may mean different things in different countries, depending upon which version of the Berne treaty was signed and whether the country made any reservations to adherence. In some countries the treaty is self executing, thus not needing any additional legislation, while in other countries implementing legislation is required according to the constitutions of the particular country. (The United States enacted implementing legislation when it joined.) Berne provides for minimum standards of copyright protection. In order to determine the duration of copyright in a country outside of the United States, one must determine the particular country in which the work is to be enforced, the country of origin of the work, and whether the work is still protected in the country of origin. Some countries adhere to the "rule of the shorter term" in which works are not protected for a longer term than protection is granted in their country of origin. Generally, laws relating to contract law, and ownership rights are governed by the laws of the country of origin, while the laws relating to copyright are governed by the law of the country of origin. Thus, rights relating to ownership of copyright should be determined by the country of origin, while rights relating to enforcement should be based on the law of the country of enforcement. It is necessarily easy to determine which law will be applied by a particular country in enforcement copyrights of origin outside of the enforcement country. Copyright under civil law countries tend to focus much more significantly on noneconomic rights associated with copyright, and copyright is more likely to be referred to as "authors rights" or "droit d'auteur." Author's rights encompass both economic rights and "moral rights". In France, moral rights are tied to the cultural heritage of the country and played a role in the French Revolution. France is considered to be the country that pays the greatest attention to moral rights. There, moral rights are said to be inalienable, inheritable and in perpetuity. In other countries, moral rights may be assigned away in various degrees, and may be conterminous with economic rights of author's. Moral rights generally include the right of paternity and the right of integrity. The right of paternity means the right to have one's name associated as the author of a work. The right of integrity means the right to make sure that the work maintains its artistic integrity and thus is not changed in a way which maligns the work or its author. Other moral rights exist to one degree or another in various countries, which include the right to determine the first publication of a work, and in limited circumstances, accompanied by compensation to the exploiting party, the right to have a work removed from circulation. Moral rights are required in Article 6 bis of the Berne Convention. The moral rights are said to extend even after the transfer of copyright during the autohr's lifetime and exercisable after death during the term of copyright. Works of foreign origin which went into the public domain in the United States may have been restored in the United States if the reason for falling into the public domain was based on the failure to publish with a copyright notice, or the failure to renew a copyright registration, and in certain other highly limited circumstances. Most countries in the world do not have copyright offices comparable to the United States. However, many countries do have various registration requirements, not necessarily for copyright, but as a requirement for distribution of the work in the country. In addition, some particular industries have their own private registration schemes. Some of the same benefits of registration are provided by various presumptions in courts outside of the United States. In some situations, United States registration, though not formally available as proof, may be helpful to establish some of the same presumptions though some countries may not recognize the presumptions which are commonly used in some countries to prove copyright ownership. It may be difficult to enforce copyright in some countries, not because the countries do not have copyright laws, but because the procedures in inherent in obtaining relief as a practical matter make it highly unlikely to obtain the relief sought. In other situations, the remedies available are either not available, or not likely to be enforceable. The United States, a significant exporter of intellectual property rights, has aggressively sought to obtain copyright enforcement throughout the world to protect its substantial interests in the copyright arena. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Disclaimer Links to other web sites provided as a convenience. No responsibility is assumed for the content of web sites referenced. Their inclusion does not necessarily constitute an endorsement of the linked cite, nor does the inclusion here of a reference to a web cite or a link to a webcite represent an endorsement by web cite referenced or its sponsors. Comments are generalizations and may not apply to every situation. Matter included here or in linked websites may not be current. It is advisable to consult with a competent professional before relying on any written commentary. No attorney client relationship is established by the viewing, use, or communication in any manner through this web site. Confidential information should not be sent by e-mail or otherwise through the internet. It may not be secure, may lose its confidential character and may lose its ability to be protected by the attorney-client privilege. Paul D. Supnik is a member of the State Bar of California and not of any other state or country. The material set forth herein is not for the purpose of soliciting any engagements where to do so would be to offend or violate the professional standards of any other state, country or bar. This web site Copyright 1996 by Paul D. Supnik |
| Re: Need HELP with site! |
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| chachi |
| 09/14/00 at 19:39:25 |
Incidentally there is no copyright in islam so if the salafi people complain ask them what the root of the word kufr means ok?! *s* i think this should answer your question since your copying islamic stuff..badawi is his own person , suffice to say i know that he kissed the hand of gaddafi ...and we know about gaddafi and his 'green book'..scholars and dollars people, scholars and dollars |
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| proudtobemuslim |
| 09/15/00 at 11:03:00 |
| Assalam-u-Alaikum, Forgive me for my ignorance, but who is/was Gaddafi, what is his Green book and what does it have to do with 'dollars'? Wassalam-u-Alaikum |
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| jannah |
| 09/15/00 at 11:12:59 |
| What do you mean there is no copyright in islam? To quote a brother who makes his living based upon sale of islamic nasheed's he produces: Narrated Abu Bakr (may Allah be pleased with him) that The Messenger of God, may peace be upon him, is reported to have said in his sermon on the Day of Sacrifice in Mina: "Your blood, your property and your honours have been sanctioned against by you, like the sacredness of this day of yours, in this month of yours, in this town of yours." Muslims are allowed to `hold/own' things - this is not forbidden in any way and there are laws set by God Almighty in the Qur'an for those individuals who steal. The word `copyright' means specifically `the right to copy'. I `hold/own' the exclusive right to copy my original work. This is my right not just as the producer of that work, but it is my God given right as a Muslim. btw what exactly are you implying about jamal badawi? [quote] Incidentally there is no copyright in islam so if the salafi people complain ask them what the root of the word kufr means ok?! [/quote] |
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| chachi |
| 09/15/00 at 20:44:17 |
salaam with all due respect, islam has a concept of ijaaza , the idea that a student may not be allowed to teach to others because he may be incapable, some people have turned this into 'copyright' if you ask the sharia school in england they will tell you there is no copyright in islam, they may even send you one of their leaflets that dealt with the issue. next with regard to the issue of the word kufr , you probably know better than i do that it comes from the root for 'to cover up with soil' that is truth is being covered up ... in islam knowledge cannot be owned by anybody it is something that is given away, you may know that the majority of the early scholars of islam were non-arabs eg Imam abu hanifah was persian/afghan because the only people who were interested in islamic knowledge at that time were the poor and the humble, the arab muslims had become too interested in wealth. None of these people paid to propagate this knowledge, it was free! Ok now the background to the idea of copyright, a trademark is by the way something slightly different (it protects the reputation of a product from shoddy workmanship) , copyright is a product of the printing press, because the well-off classes in the west wished to make a profit both from fiction and less so fact. You surely know what hadrat ali said about story-tellers and which has also been repeated by imam malik that they change the truth, in regards to fact the whole notion of university educated elites who derive an advantage from having rich parents would be dead without copyright, since copyright reduces the reach of knowledge to those who can afford it. In islam we have the idea of a scholar or gifted student being paid by the state, by zakat or teaching for a living If you are still enamoured of the idea of copyright consider 2 things 1) in the 1800's it was an offence for a factory worker to leave the uk because of the fear that he would spread knowledge about industry to other countries, why did you think european countries tried so eagerly to prevent weapons like guns getting into the hands of other peoples? because they could be copied! as happened to the british in afghanistan (the lee-enfield is still going strong ask the russians!) now give me an example where muslims tried to prevent the spread of knowledge? in fact at least 3 popes were educated in muslim universities! The muslims were so far ahead of their time that the technology of muslim society hadn't caught up with it's knowledge! (see the crusades by bamber gascoine , people in uk who used to watch university challenge will know who i mean, for evidence that muslims already knew that if the atom was split it would destroy baghdad!, imam muturidi had already discussed the issue of uncertainty at the atomic level..see imam mustafa ceric's phd thesis ) the reason why europe managed to leap ahead was the knowledge was free they treated african peoples as machines (remember the ship?) and they looted the mechita peoples wholesale, the muslims despite the prohibition by the prophet of giving credit to non-muslims accepted 'promissory notes' (which became banknotes) from the kuffar because they KNEW how much gold had been looted from the aztecs, and eventually the kuffar ceased giving them gold and they just gave them promissory notes, illusory money which meant that the muslim economies were now dependent upon kaffir decisions about inflation (you may know that it was the French also known as the Ferengi who had originally decided to destroy the islamic state by giving muslims impure gold coins, a policy which was not as successful as the above) so you see? illusion upon illusion! why do you think interest is banned? because it is a concept of wealth that gives birth to wealth, it is a sign of dajjal , pure illusion. in the modern age you'll know that poor countries are having their natural remedies stolen and then sold back to them! which makes it impossible for the poor to get this medicine if the whole concept of intellectual property is so wonderful tell me exactly how many diseases have been cured by modern medicine..and don't give me the names of vitamins! the question that arises is this , you may keep your philosophies and your dogma's and sell them, but quoting hadith in a article and then making it possible for only the rich to read it is the same as hiding the knowledge! jazakalla as imam malik said to somebody once who asked him why he did not dye his beard...you have taken justice from the people and you tell me about my beard! |
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| chachi |
| 09/15/00 at 20:56:44 |
Gaddafi is a man who does not implement islam and thus although we cannot call a bad muslim a kaffir , gaddafi can be called a kaffir because of what it says in al-quran verses 5:43-45 go and read them ;^) don't expect me to spoon feed you! His philosophy is arab socialism which can be critisised for a) not being islamic and if it was islamic why would he call it arab socialism A few decades ago some brothers decided to have a debate with him about his views, they were from the same party that had a debate with imam khomeini about how he should implement islam, imam khomeini disagreed with the brothers but let them live, gaddafi not only disagreed with the brothers , when they published the full transcript of their debate he had them killed by being tied to the back of a lorry and being dragged over rocks, no doubt he felt his 'copyright' was violated. the name of gaddafi's book is 'the green book' he obviously thinks the quran is far too complicated, like himself it is full of a lot of hot air and vague pronouncements. Dr badawi is a good scholar intellectually. i may disagree with some of his views because i come from the indo-pak tradition of schools that had ijaaza and dr badawi can be pretty liberal , for instance he says that all cheese is halal (obviously it's a issue of rennet) neverthless i would accept that his view may well be valid and a lot of islamic scholars may well be wrong. What i will NEVER respect him for, is for kissing gaddafi's hand when they met, a hand which is soaked in the blood of muslims wasalaam i hope that explains |
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| Saleema |
| 09/15/00 at 23:14:48 |
| Assalamoalykum, Agree with you all the way Chachi!!!!!! Wassalam, Saleema |
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| Arsalan |
| 09/16/00 at 00:01:57 |
| Assalamu alaikum, [quote]What i will NEVER respect him [Jamal Badawi] for, is for kissing gaddafi's hand when they met, a hand which is soaked in the blood of muslims[/quote] SubhanAllah! You have said a very big thing brother! Can you tell me how you found out about this act? When did he do this? And why, in your opinion, he did that? And what makes you think that he did it for that reason? I'll save my comments until I hear an answer from you. Wassalamu alaikum. |
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| Saleema |
| 09/16/00 at 12:33:53 |
| Assalamoalykum, really, for me it is also hard to believe that badawi would do such a thing or for that reason. I admire the man. yes, please do enlighten us more on that. I hope its not a "i heard from so and so." thing. Maybe if he did it was before gadafi (the other guy) did all that stuff. Wassalam, Saleema |
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| proudtobemuslim |
| 09/17/00 at 12:44:41 |
| Assalam-u-Alaikum, On a different note, would anybody know anything about Al-Hijra magazine's web site or other contact? Is anybody living near their offices or has more information on them? Thanks Wassalam-u-Alaikum |
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