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Tell me sisters
Anonymous
03/08/01 at 17:50:07
Asalamu alaikum! I have been a Muslimah for some time now, I mean I am revert. But I do not wear the Hijab yet. I know the importance of Hijab and that is order from Allah and our Prophet(SAS) but still I have not reach this moment to put it on. I do not consider myself hypocrate as you wrote some Quran or Hadith on this board. But I start to worry about my believe in Our Creator as I not follow yet this very command. I just want to ask the revert sisters how long after they became Muslimeen they start to wear the Hijab. Thanks. as-salaamu alaikum

Re: Tell me sisters
princess
03/08/01 at 18:38:01
walikumas'salaam warahmatullah :) [quote]I do not consider myself hypocrate as you wrote some Quran or Hadith on this board.[/quote] not wearin a hijab doesn't make u a hypocrite :) fear not :) i think it's soo awesome, mashAllah that u've come to islam..i have soo much respect and appreciation for reverts..:) [quote]I just want to ask the revert sisters how long after they became Muslimeen they start to wear the Hijab.[/quote] although i'm not a revert..i didn't start wearin hijab, almost until i was 18..:) there's no "set" time..yes, u should wear it, but when u're ready..don't automatically wear hijab, if u aren't ready or comfortable answering questions about it :) just my 2 bits :) no 1 bit my head off :) inshAllah that helped u :) ma'salaam ;-D

Re: Tell me sisters
PacificBreeze
03/08/01 at 19:56:30
[quote] not wearin a hijab doesn't make u a hypocrite  [/quote] ummmmmm...i'm not sure if you can technically say that...

Re: Tell me sisters
se7en
03/08/01 at 20:32:48
How would not wearing hijab make you a hypocrite? A hypocrite is defined as one who's external does not match their internal.  And I think, even if you do argue that, it is not the case for all people. Let's try to be careful with labels like "hypocrite".

Re: Tell me sisters
Laboogie
03/08/01 at 20:38:09
As-salamu alakuim   Before I took my shahada(at 18years old; Im 21 now,going on 22 :) I started to wear hijab so I could get a feel of it, to get use to the fact that one day I would be wearing it soon. And making others around me aware of what are the changes I was going to be making in my life.  And when I took shahadah I was ready to put the hijab.  But everyone has different feelings and experiences in this matter; In my case I couldnt wait to wear hijab, I think that was one of the things that I was looking forward to when becoming muslim :) I hope this helped; again as Princess mentioned you should wear it wear you are ready but please do not make excuses like many of our sisters make. Salams

Re: Tell me sisters
PacificBreeze
03/09/01 at 01:05:30
a hypocrite in the sense that you know what's obligated n Allah's command yet you reject it... anyways..are there more newly hijabi sisters out there to share their experiences for our anon poster? :)

Eh?
AbuKhaled
03/09/01 at 09:01:13
Assalam alaikum wa rahmatullah dear Sister/Brother PacificBreeze, <a hypocrite in the sense that you know what's obligated n Allah's command yet you reject it...> I don't wish to be rude, but could you elaborate on how you arrived at this definition of hypocrisy, since I have neither seen it in a dictionary of the english language, nor does it coincide with the linguistic definition of nifaq, nor a shari'i definition, so I'm at a slight loss about where you take this understanding from? Furthermore, I have two remarks to add: 1. It would perhaps fall into a *rational* definition of the english word hypocrite if one *called* to that which one didn't themself practice, e.g. telling others to pray fajr whilst yourself never praying it, ma'adallah. But hypocrisy cannot be concluded here from the little the our beloved Sister in Islam has revealed about her situation. 2. Acknowledgement of a command and non-observance of it is not the same as rejection of it. Rejection would be effected if one *denied* the command, but cannot be inferred just by someone not abiding by the command. Not practicing that which is obligatory is not rejection. It could be many things, such as apathy, indifference, lack of understanding, and so on. That should not be misconstrued to mean that it is okay not to abide by the 'amr [command' of Allah ta'ala as long as one isn't rejecting that command. Astaghfirullah, Abu Khaled

Re: Tell me sisters
Kathy
03/09/01 at 08:57:33
slm It took me about 4 years to wear it all the time.- I regret that it took so long- If I had known the advantages I would have worn it a lot sooner! May Allah swt forgive me.

Re: Tell me sisters
destined
03/09/01 at 15:33:18
[quote]It took me about 4 years to wear it all the time.- May Allah swt forgive me.[/quote] slm, I am a born Muslim (alhamdulillah), I started hijab last yr when I was 19, may Allah swt forgive me too for taking so long.  But as I like to say, it's better late than never.

Re: Tell me sisters
Anonymous
03/09/01 at 17:23:33
Salaam, I started wearing hijab four months after I converted.  Here are a few tips that can help you get used to it: - Wear it at home so that you get used to the feeling of having a hijab on your head.  Look at yourself in the mirror and say "Masha'Allah!  I look so nice!" (yes, I'm joking a bit:)) - Try to wear it during the weekends (if you work or study during the week) to go for a walk, or shopping, etc. - If it can help, ask a sister who wears it to accompany you the first time you go out with it; insha'Allah it will make you feel stronger. - The most important: make du'as.  Ask Allah to give you the strenght to do it. Hope this helps, Wassalam

Re: Tell me sisters
UmmZaid
03/09/01 at 20:34:00
Salaam 'Alaikum Oh here is my hijab tale... ;)  Don't we all have one?  NOTE TO ALL BROTHERS: I like to hear your beard and thobe / turban / kuffiyah whatever stories!!! I started wearing hijab all the time about... Hmm.. 2 yrs and a half after I decided to learn more about Islam and become a practicing Muslim...  Before that, I had a myriad of excuses... that I didn't want to draw attention to myself.. that I wouldn't get a job.... that my parents would kick me out... and there was a time when I was fooled by the arguments of some within our community that it is not required, so I didn't believe that it was a fardh.  I only wore it around the Muslims or when I was out with a Muslima friend.  I think I was tooooo shy to wear it on my own.  I thought I would draw a lot of attention to myself. I started wearing it May of 1999.  I went to Northern California to attend a conference at Zaytuna.  I didn't wear the hijab on the plane, but I did start wearing it the next day when I was around the Muslims.  Subhan'Allah, a lot of the hijab-related fitnah that we had (have?) here on the East Coast was NOT present there.  All of the sisters were in hijab, in different colors, in ethnic dress, beautiful dress, with nur (light) in their faces, not just the black black black clothes with dour faces that I was used to here.  I ended up not taking my hijab off at all the whole week I was in Cali.  On my way back to the East Coast, I WAS afraid of being harassed in the airport -- I was flying back alone, and this was when they were saying that they were going to examine "suspicious" passengers more rigorously for "terrorist threats" or whatever.  And I DID get stared at in the San Francisco Airport (world capitol of freaks, and *I* got stared at!)  Some Serbs who were on my flight apparently thought I was Bosni or Kosovar (this was right after the air war against Serbia), b/c they started being really  nasty and talking bad about me, but I got through it. The day after I returned home, i went to lunch with my parents.  My mother said, "You're not going to ... wear that... thing, are you?" I said, "Why?" She goes, "Because it's so... so..." I go, "Embarassing?" She goes, "Yeah." I said, "Well I wear it full time now, so let's get over it."  Since then, she hasn't said a peep, except to comment on which color scarves make me look withdrawn, and that she prefers regular clothes and scarves to jilbab and the big cape khimars.   I have found that hijab is NOT an obstacle to my work (except, oddly enough, a few times when I sought employment in MUSLIM owned companies!!!)<rolling eyes>  Of course, there are lots of Muslims where I live, but... I got offered three jobs in the same day once, and two of those jobs were from non Muslims who were more than willing to accomodate me.   I have to be truthful and say that there HAVE been a few ugly incidents with people cursing me, giving me dirty looks, and two incidents of physical threats. (IN the first, a middle aged couple almost ran me over in a parking lot, even though I was visibly pregnant, and in another, after the USS Cole, a man tried to run  me off a major highway, into a ditch, with my kids, while screaming his head off at me).  I've been screamed at by old Jewish ladies in the supermarket (this is a VERY JEWISH area, so, I get that too), and I once got into it with an airport worker at JFK airport who apparently thought I didn't speak English so that she felt she could talk nasty about me and my baby (!!) and I wouldn't understand.   And I live in NY, probably the most cosmopolitan city in the country.  (Despite their image of sophistication though, I find NY to be extremely racist and many people here to be ignorant).  I don't know what it would be like to be muhajaba in a place like Tennessee or Idaho.     ON THE OTHER HAND... I have found that employers take me more seriously RIGHT OFF THE BAT, since they know for sure that I am not going to be out drinking or drugging or stealing or cheating them on breaks, etc.  I have also found a greater rapport with older women and men.  there are many people in this heavily Catholic area who are *glad* to see young women with modesty, and they aren't afraid to tell you that.  I've even had positive exchanges with older Jewish people, mainly immigrants, who seem to sense that you will not be rude or curt with them if they approach you like so many young people today are.  I've found men in my classes at school, at work, and in other situations more at ease with me, and VERY respectful of my religion and whatnot.  They talk to me like a PERSON not a potential date.  The sexual tension just isn't there, and allows both parties to get down to what you need to do (classwork, projects, etc.)  without the games.  Even women.  I have found it easier to make small talk and joke around with other women in stores, and actually, a lot of women are intrigued by the dress (which is why I always always try to dress my absolute best), they are interested to know why you wear it, or how you pin it on and where you get it from.  I've been approached by devout  Christian women who are RECLAIMING the veil (in accordance with Corinthians and other Biblical passages) about where to get the clothes.   Another worry I had before becoming muhajaba was the heat.  It gets very hot and humid here in NY, and I was dreading the heat and humidity.  Subhan'Allah, right after I took the hijab, it was hitting temperatures of like 100 degrees here.  Wallahi, I didn't feel it at all. I was totally fine, while everyone around me was complaining! Another positive benefit: on two occasions I have been stuck without a car or with a broke down car, including one time in the Bronx at midnight when it was raining and I had my young child with me and would have had to walk past young gangbanger types up a steep hill to get help.  In both instances, MUSLIMS stopped to help me b/c they IDENTIFIED me as a Muslima in trouble!  Alhamdulilah!   These are just some of the benefits and the few disadvantages I've experienced as a muhajaba woman.

Re: Tell me sisters
UmmZaid
03/09/01 at 20:41:16
PS I forgot to add another benefit. I didn't start getting the majority of marriage proposals until AFTER I was muhajaba.  Heh heh heh.

Re: Tell me sisters
meraj
03/09/01 at 21:10:12
slm, [quote]I don't know what it would be like to be muhajaba in a place like Tennessee or Idaho.[/quote] well i live in alabama (and no, im not a hijabi ;-D ) and my mom and my sisters have been wearing hijaab for quite some time now... of course, they have had their share of less than decent encounters with ignorant and/or prejudice people, but one htingn that i have noticed is that even some of the people who dont know much about other faiths at least have manners and at least respect other beliefs. then may ask questions and all which is def good, but most of the time they dont approach negatively... they actually want to know more about it. in fact, my sister was probably the first muslimah in our community and her general age group to start wearing hijaab full time.. she started when she was in high school, and alhamdulillah, lots of other sisters have gotten courage and inspiration from her and have become successfully hijaabified :) so to all your hijabis out there... no matter how bad it seems, just remember that theres brothers out there who are behind ya 110%... not to mention Allah is really happy with ya :) POWAH TO THA (hijabi) PEOPLES! ;-D ma'salaam, :) meraj 'i have a dream' dude

Re: Tell me sisters
Anonymous
03/09/01 at 23:25:46
Salaam Aleikom to all sisters and brothers! Thanks for your answers! Dear s/b Pacific Breese, cann you stend up in front of Allah on the day of account and tell him I am a hypocrite. Did you open my heart, can you see my soul and the fightings inside me? May Allah forgive you! I know of many Muslims who drink alcohol and make fornication day after day, do not fast during Ramadan, yet I CAN NOT say that they are hypocrites. I am not perfect, are you, Pacific Breeze? May Allah accept our good deeds and make us from the people of Jannah! Ameen! Dear sisters, I continue to follow your answers to my first question. Thanks to all of you! Your sister in Islam(for those who agree to be my sisters in Deen)

Re: Tell me sisters
Arsalan
03/09/01 at 23:44:33
[slm] Anonymous, I think you misunderstood Pacific Breeze. She was not pointing a finger at you.  She was just replying to the statement of princess and speaking in general.  Her statement was of a more technical nature rather than a personal attack.

Re: Tell me sisters
Laboogie
03/10/01 at 18:10:38
as-salamu alakium  Hey sista Saraji what part of NYC you from? I have to say that I havent seen or have experience any of these things that you mentioned (and Im a native New Yorker :) "Subhan'Allah, a lot of the hijab-related fitnah that we had (have?) here on the East Coast was NOT present there. All of the sisters were in hijab, in different colors, in ethnic dress, beautiful dress, with nur (light) in their faces, not just the black black black clothes with dour faces that I was used to here."  I have found that the sisters in the city have so much style :) They wear their khimars/hijabs in so many different styles and even though the clothes that they wear may be very westernized, I personally think they accomadate it to the islamic standards ( I can testify to that):) So let me know were you have experienced these "black black black clothes with dour faces" so I can let you know where the Happy, smiling and beautiful clothed  sisters are :-) salams

Re: Tell me sisters
UmmZaid
03/10/01 at 21:30:09
[quote]Saraji what part of NYC you from? I have to say that I havent seen or have experience any of these things that you mentioned [/quote] I don't live in the city.  I  live in Westchester County... 'nuff said, eh?  Also, I've had awkward experiences in Manhattan, and Staten Island,  where a woman did her darndest to deny me the opportunity to open a bank account there (she was a Jew too), and eventually did close my account using deceptive means.  (I won't say the name of the bank, but they have a red and white logo, and they have a commercial showing different areas of NYC metro region, like "Town Library, Greenburgh" or something and it shows all the commuters reading the Wall ST. Journal.) Ironically, in the Bronx, I've had very positive experiences, especially among the boyz hanging out on the street doing their gambling and dealing and what not.  Whenever I would come down the street, they would move to the side, and hide their beer bottles and say "STand aside for the sister."  :) >>So let me know were you have experienced these "black black black clothes with dour faces" so I can let you know where the Happy, smiling and beautiful clothed  sisters are :-)<< Well, this was a few years ago that I was referring to, and it seems to me that this sort of mentality has died down.  And  this was mainly, actually, in certain masajid in NJ where I used to live.  Like the masjid that refused entry to sisters who were not in jilbab.  And Allah help you if that jilbab was any color other than black, b/c you would get dressed down about it, and then came the "Why aren't you wearing niqab sister?" stuff, and why are you wearing a regular scarf instead of a cape style khimar, and so on.  For me to come out of that atmosphere and then see what it was like at Zaytuna was really mind boggling.   However, I still have to say that the attitude here is much, much more than out there, but I think that is a general New Yorker thing.  I found the Muslims out in Cali to be much more open and friendly, and everyone seemed to know right away that my friend and I were from NY, even though we both felt like we weren't throwing shade or something.  ;)

Re: Tell me sisters
salamrae
03/11/01 at 01:54:13
Assalamu Alaikum I started wearing hijab about two years after conveting/reverting to Islam. I had begun to wear long sleves and loose clothes but not a scarf. I would wear one to muslim events, and to the mosque for jummah, etc. One day I had attended Jummah prayer and my two daughters and I went to the Arabic grocery store to purchase some things. The owner who know my husband and I , said "congratulations" I said "what?" he said " congratulations on wearing hijab now" I did not tell him I was only wearing it because I had just came from the mosque,I couldnt take it off after that. It was easier after that. And my husband, who works out of town , came home and saw me wearing it. He was happy. And after that he began to practice Islam more and slowly became strong. In my city it is easy, most people dont care . There is alot of culture hear, alot of people from different countrys. The hardest part was wearing it in front of my very strong Christian family. But I got over it and now its easy. My daughter is seven and in the second grade. There are many muslims in her school. And some of the girls wear a scarf. One day one of them saw my daughter at the mosque and asked her why she does not wear her scarf at school. After that , she wears her scarf everyday to her public school.  I did not ask her to , she wanted to. If she can do it, we as adults should be able to find the strength. I hope this helps you in your decision.

Re: Tell me sisters
Laboogie
03/11/01 at 10:21:34
as-salamu alakium "I found the Muslims out in Cali to be much more open and friendly"   I have to agree with you on New Yorkers not being as friendly.  I dont know what it is, I guess it's a NYC thing, you know ( I dont agree with it though)[Thats one of the reasons I think I wont be able to live here when I grow-up] :) {you know when I graduate from college and start being responsible} :)     I also have to say that I have experienced sisters not being welcoming in certain masjids in the city, either b/c I dont look like them or Im not wearing what they consider to be proper Islamic clothing.     I hear what you are saying but I still have to say that we New Yorkers have Style :), hey we are in one of biggest fashion cities in the world. Also it might be the younger generation who are exploring these different styles; bring in the hip hop style, village style,etc... but yet keeping it to islamic standards, BUT I have to say I have seen some older sisters who got some funky and creative styles :) Salams.

Re: Tell me sisters
nehar
04/23/01 at 06:30:36
salam LONG LIVE THE HIJAB!!! W/SALAM P.S:how do i get a pic of a hijabi???

Re: Tell me sisters
jehad
04/23/01 at 07:36:16
asalm walakum, i don't wear hijab, and i'm never going to, thats cause i'm a guy. any how, over the last few years my part of london has become full of turks. european ulimah wear a kind of tighly packed turbin. Me and my brother were praying in one of the Turkish musjids, and my broth got given a turbin by one of the turks. because he was wearing one, i wanted one as well, so i requsitoned one of my mums hijabs that was made out of the same material and used it as a european turbin. Thats kind of like wearing hijab? does that make me a muhijab?

Re: Tell me sisters
Saleema
04/23/01 at 12:00:17
Assalam ualykum, I would say that makes you a muhajiba Jehad. LOl

Re: Tell me sisters
Barraa
04/24/01 at 14:09:12
listen up here! hijab is a MUST. and walahi there is no such thing as "i am not ready for it" dont take this as an insult but walahi allah said if u are a women and past the age or puberty you must wear it. and for males cover ur modesty and privates too. in surat al nurr u may find it says and tell the believing women to cover their modesty and lower their gaze. same with men it says. so just take it as a must and do it.

Re: Tell me sisters
jehad
04/24/01 at 14:22:56
i personally have refused to marry all of the girls who have been found for me who dont cover, or uncovered in frunt of non mohrams, and once married i will divorce my wife if she ever uncovers in frunt of non mohram , including my brothers. how can any man marry a women who cant even cover her self properly, cant even hide what allah has refused to allow her to showoff to unrelated males. what i dont know is how can any man trust that his wife will make a good mother to his kids when she hasn't even got enough morals to cover her self properly.

Re: Tell me sisters
Mary
04/25/01 at 13:26:32
Assalaam alaikum Without trying to start any trouble, 1) because I am new to this community and 2) because I am a new Muslim, I feel I need to tell you something. It is of course your right to choose a wife that will satisfy your requirements, but it is comments like yours and the tone in which you said them that for many years kept me from making the decision to surrender to Islam.  My husband would have wanted me to convert 22 years ago but knew that it was up to Allah when I would accept.  The same for hajab. Or for men growing a beard or wearing pants that do not come below the ankles. Knowing what is expected of us by Allah and getting to the point in our lives where we can surrender to His will with an open heart is part of our journey through life.  As for your comments on motherhood.  Right now I'm too upset to go into it. Just one question, do you have a check list set up for yourself to make sure you will be the best father you can be.

Re: Tell me sisters
se7en
04/25/01 at 13:28:46
[quote]Knowing what is expected of us by Allah and getting to the point in our lives where we can surrender to His will with an open heart is part of our journey through life. [/quote] excellent point mary.  that's definitely something we should consider before making judgements or assumptions about people.

Re: Tell me sisters
Mary
04/25/01 at 14:12:06
Assalaam alaikum  I have been a Muslim for a little over two years.  I have only worn the hajab (on my own) for the last four or five months.  Before that it was only for prayers, to the Masjid or other Islamic functions or when my husband would ask.  In the beginning he asked a lot but it always put the day in a bad tone.  Because of me.  I wasn't ready to wear it.  I hated being told what to do! (even though he was just asking, I would immediatly get defensive).   As I began to learn more it was always on my mind but I still had reservations.  What would friends say?  Family say?  Then it got to the point that when I would see other Muslim women in the store I felt bad that I wasn't recognized as a sister by them.  I started wearing it when I would shop alone.  (Midnight at Walmart.)  Then more and more and I liked being recognized. I loved the compliments from my husband.  He had finally stopped asking. To get my sister used to the fact that I was wearing one I ask her to sew me some longer tops and design a few hajibs. (I hate the ones that slide off my head.) and my friends don't care.   Some people stare but I usually say something to them to start a conversation. Or just come out and say It is called a Hajib and I wear it because I'm a Muslim.  No one so far has been rude.  some yell like I must not speak English and boy are they shocked when I start talking. I love little kids that say and ask all kinds of questions and their totally embarrassed parents. I wear it 95% of the time.  I have to be honest.  I don't wear it at home in the yard Or in front of male family members at my home.  Right now I'm going to go to my son's baseball game.  You will know me immediatly.  I will be the mom in the stands that looks a little different.  I'm going to have to have my sister make me a hajib in our school colors.

Re: Tell me sisters
meraj
04/25/01 at 19:16:07
slm, [quote] Some people stare but I usually say something to them to start a conversation. Or just come out and say It is called a Hajib and I wear it because I'm a Muslim.  No one so far has been rude.  some yell like I must not speak English and boy are they shocked when I start talking. ... Right now I'm going to go to my son's baseball game.  You will know me immediatly.  I will be the mom in the stands that looks a little different.  I'm going to have to have my sister make me a hajib in our school colors.[/quote] heh.. i knwo what your taliin about sr mary.. my mom and sisters get that all the time.. people speak slowly and in short sentences to them and treat them liek they dont understand english. and thats cool if ya stand out... it shows people that muslim women can do lots of normal stuff like non muslims, such as attanding their son's basketball games... aweosme dawah tool :) heh.. school color hijab... thats sure to get some attentention ;-D

Re: Tell me sisters
Kathy
04/26/01 at 08:24:19
slm I like the idea of wearing a scarf with the school colors! What are they? Hey we can make matching ones! I think our kids are in the same district! I can just see us walking down the street.... (do you think our town is ready for us?) Now where is my sewing machine....

Re: Tell me sisters
jehad
04/26/01 at 09:19:05
Asalm walakum,, i didn't try to be insulting by my comment, just honist and clear. I spoke to this lady a while back, who had been muslim much longer then i have been bourn, but only started wearing hijab a few years ago, because she never knew it was farrad, and she lives in a area with a high muslim population. no one told her. I am not saying hijab is the main issue when some one becomes muslim, but it is also not something that should be kept hidden. it should be treated like any other rule of islam. when we see some one who is muslim eatting a pork sandwich, what do we do? shouldent we do the same with coverings? a lot of people who become muslim might like pork, just like some women like showing off their hair and other parts. what i mean is that hijab should be treated like any other rule of islam. excepting allahs unity is more important then all the rules of islam, including hijab. but that goes for all the rules of islam including murder, rape, adultery and every thing. so it is true some one who is in the habit of showing off parts of the boddy that should be kept hidden, should become muslim first, and the strive to dress in a decent manner. but this goes for all actions, some one who is a habitual murderer should become muslim first as well, then try abstaining from his habbit. its just that in the west they look down on womens coverings, and consider a women as more liberated the less she wears.

Re: Tell me sisters
BrKhalid
04/26/01 at 10:01:06
Asalaamu Alaikum ;-) [quote] . when we see some one who is muslim eating a pork sandwich, what do we do? Shouldn't we do the same with coverings? [/quote] The *manner* in which you approach someone though is equally (if not more) important as the act of informing them. Its no point feeling smug that you've told a sister that she has to wear Hijab and feeling you've done your duty according to Islam if you subsequently find out later that due to your harshness she's abandoned her faith. I always think about it in terms of a school teacher trying to teach a really difficult topic in class. All teachers can inform their pupils about the subject but its only those ones who ponder on how they are going to get the message across that ultimately succeed in making their pupils understand the lesson properly. Sometimes you may indeed have something worthwhile to say but if you present it wrongly, it may be construed completely differently by the other party!!

Re: Tell me sisters
jehad
04/26/01 at 10:37:18
Aslam walakum I think a lot of brothers see women as being really dumb. And so weak that if you tell them the portion of the body Allah orders them to cover, they will run off in complete anger, and reject our belief in tawheed, and take up cross worship. This is a very arrogant out look. As I mentioned above, people fearing this, and underestimating women's Iman is the reason why the lady had not been wearing Hijab for longer then my lifetime. Trust women with the knowledge of Islam, and you will be pleasantly surprised at their devotion. Too many people try to hide parts of Islam from people they feel will run of at the mear mention of what they regard as being controversial.  People have not got the right to hide Islam from people, tell them the rules, then the people of takwa will obey them from day one, and others may delay it. But at least they will have the ability to obey if they so wish, they wont have this right is people are too arrogant to inform them.

Re: Tell me sisters
BrKhalid
04/26/01 at 11:29:40
Asalaamu Alaikum ;-) I just want to make one more point and then I'm going to flee the Akhwat!!! ;-) [quote]I think a lot of brothers see women as being really dumb. And so weak that if you tell them the portion of the body Allah orders them to cover, they will run off in complete anger, and reject our belief in tawheed, and take up cross worship. This is a very arrogant out look. As I mentioned above, people fearing this, and underestimating women's Iman is the reason why the lady had not been wearing Hijab for longer then my lifetime. Trust women with the knowledge of Islam, and you will be pleasantly surprised at their devotion.[/quote] My take is that if you start making assumptions about people and their Iman, you could end up in a whole load of trouble. Like a doctor you have to understand a patient's symptoms before you can administer a cure. If you start "assuming" what illness someone has, you may end up doing more harm than good. But see that's the fix because its real easy to give advice which may take a mere few seconds but trying to understand the reasoning behind's someone's actions takes a lot more time, effort and patience.

Re: Tell me sisters
eleanor
04/26/01 at 12:43:07
[quote]It is of course your right to choose a wife that will satisfy your requirements, but it is comments like yours and the tone in which you said them that for many years kept me from making the decision to surrender to Islam As for your comments on motherhood.  Right now I'm too upset to go into it. [/quote] slm *This* is what I'm up against. I agree fully and completely with Mary. If I had gotten that comment from you, Brother Jehad, when I first signed onto this board and posted my reservations about becoming Muslim, then I wouldn't have accepted Islam. What's with "covering yourself properly"? I don't walk around in mini skirts or in low cut tight tops. I *always* wear trousers and long sleeves. So do you think that I'm low on morals because I haven't got the courage to cover my head? There's a *BIG* difference between wearing hijab and giving up pork/alcohol. People don't stare at you on the street if you give up pork..your family don't feel embarrassed and uneasy if you give up alcohol... And as to your second point..about how mothers who don't wear hijab can't bring up kids properly if they can't even cover themself... This is the biggest insult I've ever come across..you've just insulted my mother big time, brother, so be careful. What about the mothers of reverts? The mothers of charity workers, teachers and all the millions of people who do good in the world? You think that that counts for nothing? You think that these people would have been *so much better and moralistic* if *only* their mother had worn hijab? You think that your children will benefit more only if the mother wears hijab? There's a *lot* more to motherhood than a headscarf. And finally..you equate not wearing hijab with murder, rape, adultery etc?? Do you not know brother that these are sins not only against Allah but also sins that *hurt other people*. The worst ones..ones that Allah cannot and will not forgive. Not wearing hijab is a sin against Allah. No one else gets hurt in the process and Allah is "most forgiving and most merciful". What do you think? That Allah can't see inside my head and know the struggle that's going on in there..the jihad, for him and him alone? sheeeeeesh..I'm so angry..let me calm down and later I'll come back and apologise for posting this. wasalaam eleanor

Re: Tell me sisters
jehad
04/26/01 at 14:14:47
asalm walakum, br khalid, i am  not making the asumption,  i am accusing the people who dont tell sisters the facts, of debting the iman of the sister.

Re: Tell me sisters
se7en
04/26/01 at 14:43:10
as salaamu alaykum, let's look at the way the Qur'an was revealed... specifically the ayaat about khamr... Allah established the law of the prohibition of alcohol *gradually*, in a series of four ayaat (i think) spread out over time.  Why do you think this is? It's because you cannot annihilate who and what you are and transform yourself in such a short period of time, especially when going against the grain of the society you grew up and were part of.  This can be proven again and again with converts who try to do everything in the first few months after their conversion... it's overwhelming, intimidating, and just difficult... that's why so many converts return to the way they were before they entered into Islam... In the same way, we have to teach people about the laws of Islam *gradually*.  Of course, we shouldn't hide things from people or even be apologetic about certain things that may be difficult... but we have to use hikma in the way we teach people about Islam... and we have to realize that shoving things down people's throats won't help someone out at all... take a look at the questions br abu khaled asked... I think these are essential in understanding the hijab issue... is it that the sister doesn't *know* about hijab... or are there other reasons?   br khalid said it beautifully: [quote]Like a doctor you have to understand a patient's symptoms before you can administer a cure. If you start "assuming" what illness someone has, you may end up doing more harm than good. But see that's the fix because its real easy to give advice which may take a mere few seconds but trying to understand the reasoning behind's someone's actions takes a lot more time, effort and patience.[/quote] wasalaam. ps - take a look at sister jannah's quote from the empowering of women by bewley.  definitely something we should all consider seriously.

Re: Tell me sisters
jehad
04/26/01 at 15:02:24
asalm walakum. my comments were general not specific, you asked me about your self, I can not answer the question as I AM NOT ALLAH. only Allah knows what is within your heart. You mentioned about non-Muslim women who don't cover, the statement I mentioned is completely irrelevant to them and Muslim women who are ignorant of the Islamic dress code. as they believe expectable dress is something else. kind of like if a women Europe was seen wearing nothing at all, she would be seen as completely immoral, but for amazon Indians it is a different matter, according to their law they are not doing anything wrong. It is only applicable when some one knows Islam is the truth and still refuses to except it. You mentioned something else about your reasons for not covering, only Allah can answer whether he will except you reasons, So me and all other created beings can't comment on that. You mentioned about how people don't get persecuted for pork and alcohol as they do for Hijab, that is applicable to your self but not every one else, for some women the step is easy, I have heard of one instant nikabi. In this country many of the reverts are young boys who still live with there families, they refuse to eat at home for this reason. I mentioned some other kinds of people, a family member of mine works in the prison service here, the amount of people becoming Muslim is extremely large, even sex offenders are coming in to the deen, and I have heard in America it is even bigger. Islam is spreading very quickly among the criminal gangs, many of the biggest dawa carriers have committed hideous crimes before they entered Islam. There is a Musjid were I have prayed in where a large proportion of the congregation are exdrugdealers. People do enter Islam then leave their criminal life stile. According to the morals of the gang member there is nothing wrong with what he is doing, loyalty to the gang is all that really matters, after they become Muslim loyalty to Allah is all that matters. Allah forgives all sins except for dying in shirk. Sins are sins, some are big others are small, the way to remove them is not to see them as insignificant stating that there are a lot of bigger sins, what must be done is repentance and striving to abstain from them in the future. If there is a reason why you find it difficult to abstain from a sin, then try to find ways of making it easier for you to leave it. But always remember a sin is a sin and needs repentance and extra good deeds to wipe them out. The people my comment was aimed at was not really reverts or Muslimahs who had come back in to the deen. It was more to do with Muslimahs who do cover ordinarily but show them selves when ever they can't be bothered. Example: My mum went to Saudi and told me she found some one that I will agree with, she said she is the daughter of a big Alim, and wears Nikab, and she is really pretty with red hair. Then my father came in and said the same, then I said "how the do you know what colour her hair is?" And I refused to marry her.

Re: Tell me sisters
humble_muslim
04/27/01 at 05:38:52
AA "If I had gotten that comment from you, Brother Jehad, when I first signed onto this board and posted my reservations about becoming Muslim, then I wouldn't have accepted Islam" Jehad, if I got that comment, I would be VERY, VERY careful about what I say in the future.  It is obvious that this board is attracting a lot of people to Islam, and Alhamdolillah has even helped some people take shahaddah.  This board is not about just stating the facts, but, as the Quran says, about "inviting all (to Islam) with wisdom in beautiful ways".  If you just want the facts without the wisdom, read Behishti Zewar or some other such book. I'm sorry to say this, but a lot of your posts lack humility, esp. the one when you say "I will divorce my wife if...".  It sounds like you already consider yourself to be a perfect husband, with the ability never to make mistakes or to upset your wife. Tell me Jehad, when you started observing Islam, did you IMMEDIATLEY stop every haram thing you ever did?  Cos I sure didn't.  It took me many years to reach that point, and guess what ? I'm not there yet.  And anyone who claims he is lying. Jehad, it is obvious you are not married.  If you were married, you would understand the hadith of the Prophet SAW when he said : "A woman is like a rib.  The rib is bent, and if you try to straighten it, it will break".  This hadith does NOT mean that a woman is naturally bad, but that she is SENSITIVE.  Thus when dawah about ANYTHING is given to her, there must be a BIG helping of hikmah (wisdom).  And when the dawah is really personal, such as with hijab, that is particularly true. Like I said in an earlier post, I will regret for the rest of my life that I messed up giving correct dawah to wife about hijab.  She wears it now, but it leaves an ugly taste in her mouth because of the way I (not her) acted.   To all the women who find it difficult to wear hijab, my advice is to make dua SINCERELY from the bootom of you heart for Allah SWT to give you the tawfiq to obey his commands as much as you can.

Re: Tell me sisters
jehad
04/27/01 at 11:57:35
Asalm walakum, Br humble If I had stated “if my wife drank , took drugs, cheated etc” no one would have got upset. Why are people trying to remove women’s dress code for Islam? Sins are sins, but for some reason today, it is being seen as the lest important rule of Islam and the hardest sacrifice a women can make. It is true that some one who does not cover, might be very good in other ways, and Allah might forgive them. But this goes for each and every sin, other then shirk(worshipping other then Allah), Allah is the most forgiving. Generally it is wrong to judge people, but there are occessions when it has to be done, occasions like potential marriage, testimony and employment. If a person of takwa is required for the above mentioned reasons, as no created being is able to read the heart, the only method of judging is observation of actions. These observations may be wrong, but as we are created beings, it is all we have. The minimum criteria of judging is if the person does all the farrads and abstains from all the harrams. Hijab is not the only criteria, if a hijabi publicly eats pork, or mixes with non-related men, back bites, steals, drinks, does not pray at the required time etc, then she openly sins. This refers to men and women, there are plenty of brothers who play sports with cloths that don’t cover their awrah. Boxers are well known for this. They are committing sin openly. Some one does not need to be perfect to want a wife who does not sin openly, If I am evil, and I marry a good wife, then at least my kids will have one good parent, else they will have none. If a mother uncovers openly, what kind of message does that send to her kids about obedience to Allah’s law, if the mother does not cover, why on earth will her daughters believe her when she tells them that it is farrad to cover? Actions speak louder then words. Most people I know who sin, use other sins as a evidence to justify their sins. They see some sins as exceptable, thinking that every one does them as they observe their families doing them, and use them to justify greater sins. So sins start to increase in magnitude over the generations. Not many of us are dawa experts and have the ability to do dawa in a way that leaves sweat tastes in peoples mouths. And not many of us have the ability to be certain that every time they give dawa to some one they will except it. So for me and all the other non-dawa-experts it is best that we don’t get a wife who needs our dawa. In marriage most people are looking for a wife, not a student. She is going to be a senior partner in raising the children as Allah has made work an obligation on men. She is not going to be another child that is there for you to mould in to some one with takwah. Women are grown ups not kids, men who marry women who don’t practice Islam fully thinking they can mould them, often don’t get what they expect. Me personally, I know that I am not perfect, so it is better for me to marry some one who does not sin openly as that may increase may takwah and pull me away from the sins I do, else if I marry a wife who does sin, that might encourage me to follow her example.

Re: Tell me sisters
Arsalan
04/27/01 at 12:26:42
Assalamu alaikum, What in the world is going on in this folder???  I beseech the administrators to do something about this chaos.  Every single thread is talking about the same thing.  Perhaps some threads should be locked, while others kept open.  Perhaps it should be clearly stated in the Madina Constitution that if a particular topic is already being discussed in another thread, a new thread for such a topic will not be allowed. Brother Jehaad, look at the post by Br Khalid.  A good da'ee is like a good doctor in many ways.  Before prescribing the medicine, you must look at the symptoms of the *particular* patient who is coming to you with the illness.  Only after studying the symptoms of this patient can you prescribe a medicine for him/her.  The same goes with da'wah.  There is no single way/form of making da'wah to everyone!  The method differs with every individual.  Some people need to be talked to differently than others.  You stated it yourself in your post, when you said that your comments were only for a certain group of people, not for eleanor (or her mother, or non-Muslims, etc).  Why make such a comment in a public forum when it is not intended for *everyone*??   People are at a humongous spectrum of varying levels of faith.  There are hostile non-Muslims, closed-minded non-Muslims, disinterested/apathetic non-Muslims, somewhat interested non-Muslims, really interested non-Muslims, apathetic Muslims, ignorant Muslims, Muslims caught in a bad environment, deviant Muslims, weak Muslims, Muslims who are trying to become better Muslims, and the list goes on and on! Furthermore, there are people who have had a very tough experience with something (say hijaab, marital relations, parental relations, bad experiences with other Muslims, etc).   ALL of these people need to be dealt with differently.  Look at my other post in the "Excessive focus on a Woman's Dress" thread for more on this. Let's please be more cautious on what we say to others when making da'wah.  I would take eleanor's statement, which I don't even want to repeat, very VERY seriously!  This is from a sister who accepted Islam for its beauty and has an attachment to it and is eager to learn more about it every day!   I ask Allah to forgive us for our mistakes, and to help us invite the people to His path with wisdom and beautiful speech. Wassalaamu alaikum.

Re: Tell me sisters
Saleema
04/27/01 at 12:32:11
[slm] Ok. I am locking this thread. This discussion is going on in too many threads. Please, everyone let's watch what we say. [wlm] Saleema
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