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[Reviews] Islam an Empire of Faith PBS subject on Islam..!!!
rsaleh
05/09/01 at 14:40:17
As'slamu Alykum all; Did any one watch last night's PBS's program on ISLAM?! What are your views on the program? -Rodwan

Re: PBS subject on Islam..!!!
Saleema
05/09/01 at 10:39:23
[slm] I was offended by one part. When they were describing Prophet Mohammad's death they showed the women beating their faces in the street and the men dancing??? I don't think people did that. I don't remember anything like that. And they showed the Arabs with the dhol. I don't know if that's what you call it but that is not an Arab instrument. That is an Indian instrument. [wlm] Saleema

Re: PBS subject on Islam..!!!
morning_mist
05/09/01 at 11:15:18
assalaamu alaikum, i saw it and i really liked it :)  i learned so much from it.  considering that it was made by non-muslims, historically it was pretty accurate and i was impressed with how respectfully it was done.  something that stuck out to me was that when they showed scholars studying in Baghdad, they showed women studying as well ... nice to see that.  usually the scholarship of women is ignore.     its amazing to see that some of the people who spoke on the documentary seemed as though they were not muslim (although i don't know that for a fact) and if that is true it surprises me that they can have such a beautiful view of Islam and the Prophet sls and still disbelieve ... only goes to remind us that guidance is from Allah. i had one question though ... when they spoke about the black stone, they had said that the arabs befor islam believed it was special cuz it fell from the sky.  we don't believe that do we?

Re: PBS subject on Islam..!!!
jehad
05/09/01 at 11:41:34
no we don't. billions of things fall from the sky all the time, like russian aircraft shot down by mujahids. they are not special. once when umair radiallah was going arround the kabah and was about to kiss the black stone, he said to it, if the mesanger swa didn't kiss you i wouldn't.

rating..
princess
05/09/01 at 11:53:27
as'salaamualikum :) [quote]I was offended by one part. When they were describing Prophet Mohammad's death they showed the women beating their faces in the street and the men dancing??? I don't think people did that. I don't remember anything like that.[/quote] i totally agree..:) we watched it @ the FPC (five pillars center) and that was the only thing that was a bit disturbing :( they said that those ppl were shi'as..but over all, i really enjoyed it, because it covered everything, but just the bits..it highlighted all sorts of things :) later langur ;-D

Re: PBS subject on Islam..!!!
jannah
05/09/01 at 12:46:53
wlm, i posted my comments [url=http://www.jannah.org/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl/YaBB.pl?board=albany&action=display&num=2674]here.[/url]

Re: PBS subject on Islam..!!!
Anonymous
05/09/01 at 14:10:42
Asalaamalaikum, Did anyone watch "Islam:  Empire of Faith" on PBS last night?  If so, what did you think of it?  I thought it was excellent. For more info visit http://www.pbs.org/empires/islam/ This is an excellent documentary that can be used for Da' wah, educating kids, etc. About the reviews: In The Name Of Allah, The Most Compassionate, The Most Merciful ----- * TV CRITICS DOWNPLAY POSITIVE IMPACT OF PBS "ISLAM: EMPIRE OF FAITH" SERIES AIRING TONIGHT * AFTER REQUEST, PBS EDITS 'ISLAM' (Wash. Post) ----- CAIR ACTION ALERT #294 TV CRITICS DOWNPLAY POSITIVE IMPACT OF PBS "ISLAM: EMPIRE OF FAITH" SERIES AIRING TONIGHT (WASHINGTON, D.C., 5/8/2001) Several television critics with major media outlets are apparently trying to downplay the potentially positive impact of PBS's "Islam: Empire of Faith" three-part documentary scheduled to air this evening nationwide. For example, Claudia Rosett of the Wall Street Journal wrote: "What we get here is uncritical adoration of Islam, more appropriate to a tract for true believers than a documentary purporting to give the American public a balanced account...This show bears a propaganda stamp akin to those old Soviet brochures once sent out by Intourist -- the kind that were packed with pictures of colorfully costumed ethnic minorities and wide-angle photos of verdant fields but somehow went light on the grittier aspects of the situation...If the aim of this PBS event was to give Americans a truer picture of Islam, it would have been wise to focus less on avoiding offense and more on offering some genuinely balanced truth..." In response to Rosett's review, CAIR wrote the following letter to the editor: "Claudia Rosett's sneering piece on the PBS documentary 'Islam: Empire of Faith' ('Bowing Down Before a Great Religion,' May 7, 2001) read like a review of 'Schindler's List' written by Timothy McVeigh. "Rosett accused the film's producer of indulging in Soviet-style 'propaganda' merely because he, heaven forbid, offered a generally positive portrayal of Islam. Reading her review, it is clear Ms. Rosett is so immersed in her own prejudices that she is incapable of granting Muslims this all too rare pat on the cultural back. She complains that PBS is not offering a "balanced" account of Islam based on 'reality.' Why do I get the feeling that for Rosett, balance really means criticism and reality translates into stereotyping? In today's Los Angeles Times, Elizabeth Jensen stated: "...What the program leaves out, notably, is religion, which is dealt with at times only tangentially. There is no exploration of the split between Sunni and Shiite Muslims, or the spread of Islam to areas such as Indonesia and India. Narrator Ben Kingsley explains in the opening, 'For the West, much of the history of Islam has been obscured behind a veil of fear and misunderstanding,' but that is as far as the program goes in touching on some of the more radical interpretations that Islam has taken on in a few countries today..." The New York Daily News' Eric Mink wrote: "...although the contributions of Islamic societies to mathematics, astronomy, trade, medicine and other fields are well established, the program fails to mention the pioneering advances of even older civilizations - the Egyptians and the Chinese, for example - that laid the foundations for some of the Islamic breakthroughs..." ACTION REQUESTED: 1) Go to http://www.pbs.org/empires/islam/ to educate yourself about this documentary series. 2) Find your local PBS station, by going to: http://www.pbs.org/stationfinder/index.html (Also check local newspaper listings. In most areas, the program will air from 8 p.m. - 10:30 p.m.) 3) INVITE YOUR FRIENDS AND COLLEAGUES TO COME AND WATCH THE PROGRAM. 4) Contact your local station to offer your feedback. 5) Contact PBS and the program's producer to offer that same feedback. Thank PBS for its effort to offer a positive portrayal of Islam. CONTACT PBS: PBS 1320 Braddock Place Alexandria, VA 22314 TEL: 703-739-5481 E-MAIL: viewer@pbs.org CONTACT THE PRODUCER: Mr. Robert Gardner Gardner Films 102 Hawthorn Road Baltimore, MD 21210 TEL: 410-235-5546 FAX: 410-235-5538 E-MAIL: gfi@earthlink.net COPY TO: cair1@ix.netcom.com and to your local PBS station 6) Monitor local media for negative reviews of the program. Contact those media outlets to offer your views. 7) Call 1-877-PBS-SHOP to order the video for use in schools or at home. SEE ALSO: AFTER REQUEST, PBS EDITS 'ISLAM' By: John Maynard, The Washington Post Staff Writer, 5/08/2001 http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A60868-2001May7.html The producer of a PBS documentary on the history of Islam has edited out an image of the Prophet Muhammad's face after objections from Muslim groups...

Re: PBS subject on Islam..!!!
jannah
05/09/01 at 14:23:12
This is AbdulBasir's Review posted in the Albanyia forum. Sleight of hand.. I have no idea how he got it in there when it was locked :)  alas very well written here it is: [slm] I would have to agree that, given the background of the people who made it, and the media's horrendously poor record on portraying Islam, the documentary was perhaps one of the best I've seen in comparison. There are some inaccuracies now and then, but for the most part, it was pretty well done. The cinematography was fantastic, the shots of the masjids over the world were unbelievable. What struck me the most though were the people interviewed. They were all Western, non-Muslims professors, with the exception of one perhaps, yet there were no Bernard Lewis types that drive you nuts. For the most part they were pretty fair, given that they were speaking from an "outsider" standpoint, and some made some insightful comments you usually don't hear from these educational "elite". By the way, a bit unrelated, but the documentary had some poor dubbing. Sometimes people are talking and you can really see the lack of association between the words and their facial movments. It reminded me of a badly dubbed kung-fu movie sometimes. :) Throughout the program, I was thinking to myself where Karen Armstrong was; alas, she would have been good in this program. Carol Hillebrande was there already, so I suppose they didn't need another "Crusades" expert, but Armstrong brings more to the table than just her knowledge of Muslim civilization. (Maybe that label of her being too biased [i]towards[/i] Islam coming into play?). Anyways, I could have done with less of the historian of Islamic Art, she got too much air time. One guy who was on early on, Michael Selis from Haverford, impressed me somewhat (again when I say impressed, I say so in relative terms to what we usually expect from these educational "elite"). He made some comments about the Qur'an and Tawheed which were dead on. For example, he explained how the [i]kalimah[/i] is not only saying that there is one God, but how it means much more; you are thinking about only God, and not about wealth, or power or anything else, you are not worshiping any "intellectual idols", as he put it. And some of his remarks about the Qur'an and its description of the universe, i.e as he said, "power and tenderness" are juxtaposed, and the reader of the Qur'an is made to feel the intimacy of the cosmos. When speaking of the issue of poetry and the Qur'an and Rasulallah[saw], he shrewdly quoted the Qu'ran which pointed out clearly that the Qu'ran was not poetry, but something else. These were pretty profound comments in my opinion. What also distinguishes this documentary is that unlike most others, in its portrayal of Muslim civilization it attempts to give some airtime to its origins with Prophet Muhammad[saw]. I can't remember anything I've ever seen before which spoke about the Prophet[saw]'s for a good 40 minutes like this documentary did. I have some qualms with those 40 minutes, but in general it was good. They spend much of the time describing the social context of the time. Some things that were said that were well done (again relatively speaking): -describing some of the Prophet[saw]'s qualities, including his title of Al-Ameen. -how the ethical and spiritual teachings of Islam appealed to all different segments of society and challenged the status quo of idolatry and ancestral tradition. -how the concept of Afterlife was impossible for the enemies of Islam to comprehend. -how the stage was set, given the revolutionary nature of the message, for conflict, beginning with the torture and murder of the Muslims and leading to armed conflict. This was perhaps the most important thing "said" in the first 40 minutes. Given that the West, and the Western "elite", have attacked Islam and the Prophet[saw] as violent from the start, I believe the viewer of this program has a better idea of the reasons behind the armed conflict and sees the Quraysh, not the Muslims, as the aggressors and sees these battles as simple self-defense on the part of the Muslims. For this to be in a Western documentary, in my opinion, is shocking, because a core belief in Orientalist accounts of the Prophet's life was his initiative and propensity towards violence. In addition, they spend a great deal of time detaling Fath Makkah and how compassionate and merciful the Prophet[saw] was. A few of the qualms I had with the first 40 minutes: -Despite the aforementioned account of Fath Mecca and explanation of the necessity for armed conflict, I was disappointed (and I think you could say this about some Muslim accounts of the life of the Prophet[saw]) with its insinuation that the years following the Hijrah were times of constant battle and as the documentary puts it, "the Muslims fight for survival". This is true to an extent, but nothing was said of the real [i]fath[/i], which was the treaty of Hudaybiyah. This was the true victory for the Muslims, and of course the Qur'an tells us this. It was more crucial to the survival and growth of the Muslims than perhaps anything else during the Prophet's lifetime. Given, the detail to which they were talking about early Islamic history, I was hoping that this would be addressed, but it wasn't. I suppose that's not a surprise, given that many Muslims forget about the importance of Hudaybiya themselves, and that from the documentary people's point of view, there is so little time to make your point, and talking about battles is probably much more exciting than talking about peaceful preaching. (BTW just a random comment, but I think the Hudaybiya part in "The Message" is really well done because you see it through the eyes of Khalid ibn Walid and Amr ibn 'As as they move towards conversion; my favorite part of the movie :) ) -My other major problem with the account, and this was by far the worst part of the first partiof the documentary in my opinion was when Rasullah[saw] dies. You see all this weird mourning stuff and people who are looking and acting more like the people of [i]jahilliyah[/i]. It goes on for an excruciating few minutes, with all these depictions of just weird stuff that made me crazy. Moreover, I don't thing any of that was necessary, but again, from a spectacle point of view, maybe they thought that would be more exciting for the viewer or some other dumb reason. -Hey anyone notice that they were doing tawaf backwards??? Anyways, so there's my take on the most "important" part of the documentary. The second part, however, was definitely the best, both from a visual and information perspective. The depiction of the growth of Islam, and particularly the scientific achievements of the Muslims was superb. I think Muslim viewers themselves would be astounded by some of the things that were described (I'll be the first to say that I didn't know Ibn Rushd is in Raphael's painting of the great thinkers of time or that a lot of the Renaissance paintings of Maryam AS have her in these fine garments (which were made in the Muslim world) with the [i]shahada[/i] and other Arabic calligraphy embroidered in them, which you can still see in the paintings!). And I  think any viewer from any background cannot help but see that and be left with feelings of awe, admiration and respect for Muslim civilization. I can't think of anything I've seen which showed how advanced the Muslims were in comparison to the West, with maybe the exception of the recent A&E "Crusades" documentary or (on a lighter note), the depiction of the fictional Azeem and his encounter with Robin Hood and his merry morons. :) Unforunately, after the scientific portion of the documentary, it begins to lose steam, and focus. It tries very hard to look at medieval Muslim civilization from "within", and in doing so, makes one of its major mistakes, in terms of historical accuracy, in its segment on the Crusades. The Crusades have always been of course described from a Western view, and indeed it must be if one wants to understand the motivation for the layman European leaving behind his family and farm to go fight on the other side of the world. Unfortunately, this viewpoint has neglected the goings-on of the Muslim world at the time. Therefore, in my opinion, the documentary tries to consciously explain the Crusades from the events going on in the Muslim world, and in doing so, oversimplifies and generalizes the reasons behind the Crusades. It suggests that the Crusades "began" with al-Hakim's actions, who, in opposite to the general tolerant norm of the Muslim rulers, burned the Church of the Holy Sepulchre and committed injustices towards the Christian inhabitants, which instigated the West's rage towards the Muslims. What it fails to mention (though one interviewee calls him a likely "madman") is that he most likely was extremely psychotic (he wandered into the desert one night and disappeared forever after a string of bizarre actions) and attacked the Muslims under his rule as well. I am not saying that al-Hakim's actions were not contributory to the initiation of the Crusades, they undoubtedly were, but the viewer of the program, who knows nothing about real Crusades history, would think that that alone stirred up everything. And this is the major problem with any documentary which seeks recount a complex event like the Crusades in a simplistic way. There is no mention, for instance, of the feudal warfare in Northern Europe of the time, Alexius' appeal to the Pope for some minor military assistance for defense of Constantinople, both of which contributed to Pope Urban's pleas and propaganda (who more than anyone, was more responsible for the Crusader campaigns than al-Hakim or anyone else). I am digressing here, and in the light of everything else, this is a minor flaw, but I just think that the filmakers were trying too hard to approach the Crusades from a Muslim perspective, and having found a "Muslim" to talk about in al-Hakim to help explain why the Crusades were initiated, they goofed. The reason I mention this part is because they still can't help but "revert" to the outsider perspective because after this they spend a great deal of time talking about Krak de Chavelier and the Christian Crusader state, which just didn't fit! Anyways, this "review" is getting way to long. One more positive comment and one negative comment about the rest of the documentary. It was a pleasant surprise to hear their assessment of the Mongol devastation of the Muslim world and its consequences. It is all too forgotten that the conquerors became conquered, not by any military force, but by the message of peace, the message of Islam. There are very few episodes in history, where the conquered inevitably were subdued by the creed of the people they had conquered. This was beautifully summed up in one line by the narrator (Ben Kingsley), where he says something like, "within ten years, the Mongols had gone from building towers of human skulls and bodies to building massive and magnificent mosques to glorify God". Subhanallah. The negative comment is basically the entire "third" part of the documentary, about the Ottomans, which was already addressed by Jannah. Here the documentary goes haywire, loses focus and becomes excrutiating to watch. The documentary is entitled "Islam:Empire of Faith", but the third part about the Ottomans, the documentary should be simply called "Empire", because that is all it is. There is no longer the rich sweeping storytelling of Muslim civilization that characterized the second part but rather a boring, painful account of an empire, and the Islam/Muslim part of the documentary is forgotten. It is simply an account of an empire which so happened to have arisen from a Muslim people; it was no different from something you'd see on the Roman Empire or the Ta'ng Dynasty or whatever. And it goes into some nauseating, irrelevant detail (I wish they had given this much time and detail to the Crusades or Salahuddin or basically anthing else; I agree Jannah very bad that they whisk through 900 years and suddenly focus on this in painful detail). It degnerates into a story about the soap opera that was the Sultan's court. Completely unnecessary, irrelevant, and a tarnish on the previous two parts of the documentary. Anyways, there is my (long) take on this documentary. Throw away the "Ottomans" section but by all means keep the first two parts, because who knows if you'll see another Western documentary on Islam that is this good. (again speaking in relative terms here in context of the usual media norm!). While I was watching this documentary I thought about Michael Wolfe's project to make a documentary about the Prophet[saw] for network television. Inshallah if they can get the funds (2-3 million), it has the potential to be something great. [slm]

Re: PBS subject on Islam..!!!
Arsalan
05/09/01 at 14:34:47
[slm] Brilliant analysis Abdul Basir.  How did you remember so many quotes and names after only a single viewing?  You have good memory brother, subhan Allah. I share a lot of sentiments which Br. Abdul Basir and Jannah talked about.  I'd give the program an A-.  I don't know about the excessive wailing at the death of the Prophet (pbuh) - some of that may have been true, considering the huge number of fresh converts in Makkah at the time, who did not know enough about the Deen.  But Allah knows best. I think they spent way too much time on the Ottoman Empire.  They could have used some of that time to talk in more details about the time of Khilafah-ar-Raashidah, especially Umar's time.   I liked the way they covered the Fitnah.  They did a good job, I thought. I wasn't too comfortable about the way they covered the life of Muhammad al-Fateh and the victory over Constantinople.  I'm not sure.  Did he really strangle his younger brother to death to secure the sultanate?  Did the Muslims only conquer Constantinople because it was a ripe fruit waiting to be picked?  Or did they free the people of Constantinople from the oppressive rule of the Byzantines (as it shows in the cartoon movie - "al Fateh")?   Also, I wish they had talked a little bit about how the Khilafah ended, and a little about the present day Islam and Muslims.  You know, contemporary stuff.   Anyway, overall good stuff.  I'd definitely recommend it to be shown on campuses at IAWs or what not.  PBS has definitely come a long way from Jihad in America, and I've gotta give them props for that. Wassalamu alaikum.

Re: [Reviews] Islam an Empire of Faith PBS subject on Islam..!!!
Saleema
05/09/01 at 16:17:03
[slm] The Ottoman eimpire was not the best of the empires that the Muslims had although they did do some wonderful things. I thought that the documentary praised them too much. But I agree with Jannah and AbdulBasir's review. I wanted to order it but they put me on hold for 10 minutes with some stupid music so I hung up. Inshallah I will try to order it over the weekened. Jannah, Basir, why don't you guys mail this to PBS? And no one noticed the dhol? That's an indian instrument! The arabs did not use it and I doubt they use it now either. And Arsalan I seriously doubt that the scene that they showed on the Prophet's death was like that. There may have been isolated inccidents of weird behavior like that but they portrayed everyone doing that! [wlm] Saleema

Re: [Reviews] Islam an Empire of Faith PBS subject on Islam..!!!
Mona
05/09/01 at 17:30:13
Assalamu alaikum, I think it is great that the brothers and sisters here have posted their opinions on the program.  It is wasn't aired on the buffalo PBS station that we receive here in Ontario on may 8th, but it will be on may 21st at 9 pm insha'Allah.  But I am glad that I got this little critics review from the Madina board first. Wassalam

Re: [Reviews] Islam an Empire of Faith PBS subject on Islam..!!!
Sharifa
05/09/01 at 17:01:27
I thought it was quite interesting...and reasonable for a documentary made by non Muslims.  Even with its problems, I was happy to see the other side of history...How many of us actually learned that Muslims began the Renaissance?  And I was amazed about the paintings of Mary...SubhanAllah.  I thought it gave a positive image of Islam in general. The one man pointed out that the Muslims were tolerant and believed in equality.  I thought that was wonderful. I agree with one post about too much Suleiman.  The West loves to accentuate the odd or perverted..  Look at most "heroes" or national "leaders", or even great thinkers....The history focuses on the insane...odd isn't it? Overall, I think it was good effort...the editing and dubbing was terrible..voices didn't match the speakers...but honestly, I learned a lot.  And the Islamic architecture?  SubhanAllah, we have been blessed by artists and great thinkers in our history...Alhamdulilah.  Salaam Alaikum

Re: [Reviews] Islam an Empire of Faith PBS subject on Islam..!!!
jannah
05/09/01 at 18:00:37
sharifaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa :) i really liked that walrus mustache guy too... he said alot of interesting pro-islamic stuff. it's scary sometimes that some non-muslims know more than some muslims!

Re: [Reviews] Islam an Empire of Faith PBS subject on Islam..!!!
AbdulBasir
05/09/01 at 22:08:16
[quote] i really liked that walrus mustache guy too... he said alot of interesting pro-islamic stuff. it's scary sometimes that some non-muslims know more than some muslims![/quote] "Walrus moustache guy"...i'm sure he'd love to know ppl call him that!..he has a name, that was Michael Selis, the Haverford guy I was also impressed with... [slm]

Re: [Reviews] Islam an Empire of Faith PBS subject on Islam..!!!
Arsalan
05/10/01 at 17:37:46
[slm] It seemed to me that guy was a Muslim ... no? He said "we" several times, when talking about Muslims.

Re: [Reviews] Islam an Empire of Faith PBS subject on Islam..!!!
se7en
05/10/01 at 20:45:40
I was thinking the same thing about the walrus dude/Michael Selis, the way he responded to certain questions made me think he *had* to be Muslim.. the only thing I can think to add to what everyone has said was something that jannah noted in the last couple minutes of the program... they had  a shot of some whirling dervishes and mentioned how that was a practice that went back to the time of Rasulullah [saw]... that was pretty shady.. the imagery of water was so beautiful through out the whole program..

Re: [Reviews] Islam an Empire of Faith PBS subject on Islam..!!!
AbdulBasir
05/10/01 at 22:06:17
[slm]Can we please stop calling him walrus dude/guy? :) He reminds me of my old professor who spent all these years in Afghanistan before and during the war and knew so much about Islam and was into all the spiritual aspects of Islam and had such admiration for it but if you asked him if he was Muslim, he would say something like "I have not had that 'calling' yet"... There are a lot of people like him who have a deep admiration for Islam, but aren't Muslim, at least from what we know...of course Allah and the individual only know... Anyways, about the whirling dervish part...I didn't like that either...not just cuz it said that you could trace it to the Prophet[saw]...but also it points to the weakness of that rambling, irrelevant third part of the documentary...It was like the producers were saying to themselves, umm ok we're in trouble, we've done this totally random section on the Ottomans which totally doesn't fit, and now we are in artistic limbo because how do we make a nice transition from this to a conclusion on the entire documentary...we need to find something that can get us back to the Islam part...so they must have said, oh wait check out those whirling dervishes, you see a lot of them in the Ottoman period, and it's is part of islam right, plus they are so lovely to watch, and so mysterious and mystical...just how we Westerners like our Islam (ever check out Barnes and Noble's section on Islam?)..wow look at them twirl!!, how do they do that?..oooh, ahhh...and look what happens when we put them on film, fantastic!...this is perfect, we found something to makes some sort of transition back to our original message... and wala! there you go!...(excuse my sarcasm, but let's face it, unfortunately a lot of decisions in modern filmmaking is to put on screen what looks the coolest and is most aesthetically pleasing otherwise ppl wouldn't watch...so let's dress up some people in swords and have them run around the desert with sand blowing around everywhere with this tribal music in the background, or let's show two kids running around playing with a kite over and over and over again...etc etc.) [slm]:)

Re: [Reviews] Islam an Empire of Faith PBS subject on Islam..!!!
Zahra
05/11/01 at 15:50:51
slm I'm sorry because I know I'm not supposed to be posting what seems to be pointless posts, but I just had to say that Masha'Allah, Abdul Basir's review was amazing.  May Allah reward you brother...it was so comprehensive and articulate.  Wow!

Re: [Reviews] Islam an Empire of Faith PBS subject on Islam..!!!
Asim
05/11/01 at 18:29:23
Assalaamu alaikum, I did not see the documentary so cannot comment on it personally. At jumuah today the khateeb mentioned about the documentary and basically gave it a thumbs down. His point was that when presenting factual information we should either be complete or we should not make mention of it altogether. The documentary tells the history of Islam and because it was conspicuously incomplete (and in some instances inaccurate) it will do more harm than good to people who have little accurate knowledge of Islam, who btw are the primary audience for the film. He said that misconceptions in people are harder to deal with than ignorance. He discouraged the MSA from showing it as dawah to non-Muslims. He also mentioned some inaccuracies like the translation of the ashadu an laa ilaaha illallaah in the adhaan as there is no God but God (should be Allah), and that the first revealation was brought to the prophet by an angel in the form of a man (Gabriel did not appear as a human), etc. Anyway, I just wanted to share these with you. I wish Muslims made such docuemntaries instead of non-Muslims. If non-Muslims can market this then so can Muslims, and alhamdulillah, some countries are endowed with much resources only if they have the foresight and will :( Wasalaam.

Re: [Reviews] Islam an Empire of Faith PBS subject on Islam..!!!
jannah
05/11/01 at 20:30:29
wlm, Asim I'd have to respecfully disagree with that khatib. There are so few well made nice things to show about Islam.  It was not completely inaccurate and it was well made. I think you could show it and then discuss what you liked/didn't like about it, what was accurate and what wasn't.. make it a learning experience. We can criticize all we like (and do), but we should be positive instead and use things like this to our advantage. Already peope at work who have seen it have such a different attitude about Islam. Anything that dispels myths like this for them is a good thing imho. ps agreed about wishing muslims could make stuff like this.

Re: [Reviews] Islam an Empire of Faith PBS subject on Islam..!!!
zeyn
05/15/01 at 10:25:02
as salam o alaikum, i believe muslims were behind this documentary (financing it as well as i believe riz khan from cnn was consultant) Zeyn

Re: [Reviews] Islam an Empire of Faith PBS subject on Islam..!!!
shadow493
05/15/01 at 12:17:59
Assalamulaikum I would have to say that I loved the program very much.  The main audience of the program was not towards Muslims, but towards Non Muslims.  Their goal was to clear up the misconceptions about how Islaam was spread, and others.  Personally I loved having NON MUSLIMS say praiseworthy information about our deen.  If you a non muslim living in this country it would mean more to you if someone from your own "kind" said things to clear up misconceptions.  The video clearly said that "Islaam was NOT spread by the sword..." and the one professor (who had the big mustache) said that the Quraan was the BEST book in history, b/c it "could say the most powerful things in nature in the most intimate way."  And that was awesome how this person said that.  So personally, even though the video had some faults in it (just a few), I loved it overall (and inshaAllah I am going to order the copy). Walaikum Assalam Adam Taufique :)

Re: [Reviews] Islam an Empire of Faith PBS subject on Islam..!!!
Arsalan
05/15/01 at 12:30:49
[slm] Some other peculiarities about the program: - the worshippers were praying in shee'ah style (raising hands to make du'aa after getting up from sujood back to the qiyaam position).  this seems to verify kashif's report that the shee'ahs were involved in producing this program (?) - it said that the rock inside the dome of the rock was the place where ibrahim (a.s.) attempted to sacrifice his son.  this is not true.  this event took place in makkah, not jerusalem.  however, the jews believe that ibrahim sacrificed isaac at jerusalem.

Re: [Reviews] Islam an Empire of Faith PBS subject on Islam..!!!
rsaleh
05/16/01 at 11:14:32
As'slamu Alykum all; It seems that the conversation is taking a new turn.  Al of a sudden the subject of Shiaa/Sunni started to imerge in the talks back and forth with one another. I have a question to ask.  If someone (American, or otherwise) wanted to accept Islam as his/her religion!  Which sect will we ask them to accept as thier bases of Islam?!  Will we ask them to accept Islam the Sunni way, or the Shiaait way?! I am not asking the question looking for answers, I am simply asking this question to show how much we are intangeled on the issue of Shiaa and Sunni.   What happend to simply accept Islam the way the Prphet (PBUH) intorduced it to us 1422 years ago?! -Rodwan  :)

Re: [Reviews] Islam an Empire of Faith PBS subject on Islam..!!!
chachi
05/16/01 at 18:23:09
Hmm the sunni / shia issue is largely dead in terms of politics Ayatollah Khomeini stated in his book that the shia now believed that the first three khaliphs made mistakes but not intentionally and that they were good muslims This was the major issue dividing the sunni and shia As to other practices we still disagree with them regarding mutah marriages which is our major disagreement with them and thus it is up to the person accepting islam if he accepts this concept or not and i am not best qualified to consider whether a person is muslim or not based on accepting or rejecting this idea

Re: [Reviews] Islam an Empire of Faith PBS subject on Islam..!!!
pakiprncess
05/18/01 at 16:45:37
asalaam alaikum friends - as for me, i havent seen the documentary yet...my parents have taped it and inshallah ill make time for it this weekend since im hearing such great reviews for it...but i got this email, and i was a bit confused about it (it could be because i didnt see the film itself and so i dont know which parts of the movie its referring to). anyways, just wondering if anyone had any comments on it? for and or against? (im sure youll notice some bias in it...i was a bit disgruntled over the comment about christians on the whole being ignorant...) ------------------------------ Assalamwalaikoum, dear brothers & sisters, Indeed there were seven version of the quran.  It was mainly because at that time there were different cultures and the message was to be passed and the means was justified the ends.  However as far as I know there was no major disruption in the message in any of the seven versions.  In fact none of them contradicted each other.  When Hazrat Umar decided to compile the pieces of the quran, he removed some verses which he was not sure of after veryfying the version with the hafiz.  Like for adultery the punishment of death was removed.  However those verses were carefully disected before removal.  The shahaba like Hazrat Umar was the ijma.  They had knowledge and power to perceive that even the Tabiin(after shahaba and te-tabiin) did not have.   Therefore the version that we have is a right one so don't bother yourself about it. The quran was officially recorded and compiled under Hazrat Umar due to the death of 3000 Hafiz on the battle field.  Before it was written on cloth, skin, bones and stones. So the movie to my knowledge, alhamdoulilah portrays a lot of truth that most american version have never attempted to make unless for the movie "the message" As for the christian people who thinks it is marketing, they don't have an iota of knowledge because layman of muslims know more about Allah and God and Jesus that they do.  Even the priests are ignorant. Brother we have been given the supreme religion perfected by greatness so be proud and don't question as long as it is on our side Jazak Allah ---------------------------------

Re: [Reviews] Islam an Empire of Faith PBS subject on Islam..!!!
shadow493
05/18/01 at 17:37:44
[quote] Some other peculiarities about the program: - the worshippers were praying in shee'ah style (raising hands to make du'aa after getting up from sujood back to the qiyaam position).  this seems to verify kashif's report that the shee'ahs were involved in producing this program (?) [/quote] I would like to comment of what Arsalan said.  There are "sunni" opnions (that which i follow) which support this way of praying.  If you would look in Albani, he quotes a hadeeth by Ibn Omar which says the Prophet (saw) would raise his hands before and after going into the first and second sadjaa. I know that some of this program was shot in Iran, so that could give some evidence of what Kashif is talking about.  But weather shia's were involved or not, the program was excellent mashaAllah :)

Re: [Reviews] Islam an Empire of Faith PBS subject on Islam..!!!
jannah
05/18/01 at 17:50:52
just a clarification , this seven "versions" of the Quran just means there were seven styles of writing/reciting. it does not mean there were different qurans, the quranic words remain the same as what was revealed to Muhammad saw, from Jibreel, from Allah SubHana Wa Ta`ala . Also Umar did not "remove" anything. There were a few verses that he waited on to get full verification because he wanted them to be both written down as well as memorized. When they were confirmed "on paper" the verses were part of the final written collection. i think maybe we should edit this post because we don't want anyone to be confused on the authenticity of the quran

Re: [Reviews] Islam an Empire of Faith PBS subject on Islam..!!!
Arsalan
05/18/01 at 19:02:10
[slm] Pakiprncess, I suggest you look at a book called [i]Ulum al-Qur'aan[/i] by Ahmed von Denffer.  It is an excellent, concise, work about the sciences of the Qur'an.  It includes several chapters about how the Qur'an was preserved, including a discussion on the 7 modes of recitation.   shadow, read my post again more carefully.  I know and understand that raising the hands at every takbeer (Allahu Akbar) is also reported in authentic ahaadith.  However, this is not what I was talking about.  I was talking about the raising of hands to make *du'aa* right after rising from the sujood back into the qiyaam position.  This is an act which is special to the shee'ah way of praying.  [Note that the qunoot which is made by the sunnis during the prayer also consists of raising the hands for du'aa in the qiyaam position.  However, this raising of hands for the du'aa is performed after/before *rukoo'*, not sujood.  So any argument that the people depicted in the program are praying qunoot is invalid]. Wassalamu alaikum.

Re: [Reviews] Islam an Empire of Faith PBS subject on Islam..!!!
chachi
05/18/01 at 22:05:46
pakiprncess can you please review what you wrote sis? the sahaba were worried that people might mispronounce the words because of the way they were written ..no zabber and zer as we say in urdu in those days..i think the tyrant hajjaj introduced that to make it easier for non-arabs to read the quran..maybe allah will grant him jannah on that basis as well as saving the muslim refugees from korea from indian pirates also the raising hands bit i think followers of imam shaafi's madhab do that as well and allah ho alim..correct me if i'm wrong    waslaam

Re: [Reviews] Islam an Empire of Faith PBS subject on Islam..!!!
shadow493
05/19/01 at 00:30:33
ack forgive my ignorance :(

Re: [Reviews] Islam an Empire of Faith PBS subject on Islam..!!!
Saleema
05/19/01 at 00:39:17
[slm] My dad follows the hanafi madhab. But he raises his hands at every takbeer when he prays. I didn't know that it was from the shafe madhab. I used to do that too, from watching my dad. But then I stoped. [wlm] Saleema

reBROADCAST Islam an Empire of Faith WNED-PBS channel 17 BUFFALO-NIAGARA-TORONTO
SuperHiMY
05/20/01 at 06:16:08
AsalamAlay.com,          Peace and e-Greetings be upon you fellow TV watchers,          Here in Toronto Canada,          We have access to most BUFFALO, New York TV stations.          Including the BUFFALO-NIAGARA FALLS  PBS station.          Channel 17, WNED.          They did NOT air Empire of Faith YET.          It will be Broadcast TWICE in the next few days:          Monday May 21, 2001 ,  9:00 pm :          [url]http://www.wned.org/Television/May/21L.html[/url]          (scroll down to 9 pm on their webpage listings).          And then broadcast AGAIN at:          Saturday May 26, 2001 , 1:30AM          [url]http://www.wned.org/Television/May/26L.html[/url]          I dunno if it was broadcast elsewhere in two parts.          Here, it appears they will air the complete 2.5 hour          program in one episode.                    As an aside,          I've seen the companion book at one of the used bookshops          here in Toronto, and I was quite impressed by it. :-O!          Better set the VCR on  LP  speed to make it fit.                  ~ HiMY! ~
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