Madinat al-Muslimeen Islamic Message Board
| Re: The non-Objective Religion |
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| Saleema |
| 07/20/01 at 00:36:28 |
| Also, what's up with the swinging and gyrating of the finger when pointing to the Qiblah?? I understand that in the etiquette of Salah or Sunnah that only to point once starting with the forefinger and middle finger looping with the thumb, and pointing the indexfinger on 'la ilaha...' then returning it to original position on '....ilallah'is good enough?? what's with the keeping beat?? There are different ways of doing it and all are equally valid. :) [wlm] Saleema |
| The Finger |
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| bhaloo |
| 07/20/01 at 01:17:57 |
| slm I don't know about brother picking their feet and what not. I sit in the first row just a little to the right of muezzin so I don't see a whole lot, except the wall in front of me. :) About 2 and a half years ago a friend sent me this information related to this topic of the finger. First up: lifting the index finger is sunnah: not required, but y'all got no excuse not to so JUST DO IT!!! Now the real stuff: These are some hadeeth on the topic. Read them all since they all say different stuff, and scholars have different interpretations of them… · Ibn 'Umar reported that when the Prophet (S) sat for the tashahud, he would place his left hand on his left knee and his right hand upon his right knee, and he would form a ring like (fifty-three) and point with his index finger. In another narration it is reported, "He would close his hand and point with his index finger." (Related by Muslim.) · Wa'il ibn Hajr reported that the Prophet (S) would place his left palm on his left thigh and knee. He would place the end of his right elbow upon his right thigh and would then close his right hand, forming a circle. In another narration it states, "He would make a circle with his middle finger and thumb and point with his index finger. Then he would raise his finger, and (Wa'il) saw him moving it to make supplications." (Related by Ahmad.) Explaining the hadith, al-Baihaqi says, "The implication of 'he would move it' is that he would point with it, not that he would continue to move it." This would be in agreement with the narration of Ibn az-Zubair who reported, "The Prophet would point with his finger while supplicating, and he would not move it." This is related by Abu Dawud with a sahih chain. An-Nawawi also mentioned it. · Reported az-Zubair, "When the Prophet (S) sat for tashahud, he would place his right hand on his right thigh and his left hand on his left thigh. He would point with his middle finger, and would not look beyond his pointing." (Related by Ahmad, Muslim and anNasa'i.) This hadith shows that one is to place the right hand on the right thigh without closing the hand (making a fist), and that he is not to look beyond his pointing. All of these hadith are authentic and you can pretty much act on any one of them. · Reported Numair al-Khaza'i, "I saw the Messenger of Allah sitting in the prayer with his forearm along his right thigh. His index finger was raised, curved (or bent) a little, and he was supplicating." This is related by Ahmad, Abu Dawud, an-Nasa'i, Ibn Majah and Ibn Khuzaimah with a good chain. · Said Anas ibn Malik, "The Messenger of Allah, upon whom be peace, passed by Sa'd while he was making supplications (and using) two fingers. The Prophet said to him, 'Just one, Sa'd"' This is related by Ahmed, Abu Dawud, an-Nasa'i and al-Hakim. · Ibn 'Abbas was asked about a man who pointed with his finger while supplicating, and he said, "This is sincere devotion." Says Anas ibn Malik, "That is imploring." Mujahid maintains "Doing this hinders Satan." The four schools of thought in Jamaatul Islamiyyah also differ in their opinions: According to the Shai'iyyah, you only point the finger when saying "except Allah" (il Allah) According to the Hanafiyyah, you raise the finger when saying "There is no God" (la ilaha) According to the Malikiyyah, you move the finger to the left and right (the way Bro. Mukhtar said) until you finish prayer. According to the Hanbaliyyah, you point with the finger every time you mention Allah, and don't move it at all. So look. Pretty much, the deal is, follow whatever the opinion is you agree with. And if you see others do it differently, don't flex. We're not scholars, and we don't have the right to say what's right and what's wrong, especially when scholars differ on the subject. It is always always always best to ask someone who is wise in deen, so if you are really unsure about this topic, ask your imam or teacher in your community what they think is right, and follow them. If you are following a legitimately knowledgeable scholar, and what he or she tells you is wrong, the sin is on him or her, not you. If there was benefit from this, that benefit is from Allah. And if there was harm in this, the harm is from me, and I will be held accountable. If you find something wrong in this thing, email me!!! I'd rather feel like a dork now for saying something that is incorrect than be held accountable for telling a LIE about Allah's deen on the Day of Judgement!! Please make duaa for my friend. |
| Re: The non-Objective Religion |
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| Arsalan |
| 07/20/01 at 02:07:43 |
| [slm] Brother Qamar, I don't understand what is wrong with putting objects in front of you while praying (unless they are depictions of animate objects). Where did you get the notion that there was anything wrong with this? Indeed the Prophet (pbuh) told us to put something in front of us when we prayed to use it as a sutrah. Sometimes he would put his turban in front of him, or ground a stick in the the sand to use it as a sutrah. I see no problem with putting a cell phone, or keys, or a hat, or anything of this nature in front of you while praying. Keys bother you in the prayer if you have them in your pockets (especially if they're as big as mine), especially when you sit. The same is true with the cell phones. Glasses are taken off because it is often the case that one cannot make sujood properly with them on. And they cannot be kept in the pocket because they may bend or slide out during the prayer. I am not sure at all about the Qur'an being in front of you while praying. To this day I have not heard any objection against it, and most masaajid have Qur'ans placed in front of the people on bookshelves. With regards to moving the finger in tashahhud, as it has already been explained, it is proven from the sunnah of the Prophet (pbuh) that he used to move/rock his finger during the tashahhud. I agree with you about the picking-toes bit. Wassalamu alaikum. |
| Re: The non-Objective Religion |
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| Kashif |
| 07/20/01 at 13:43:53 |
| assalaamu alaikum I just switch off the ringer tone and face the phone down whilst i pray. Its definitely true what Arsalan said about annoying things in your pocket during salaah. You have your phone on your belt, your keys in your side pocket, your wallet in the back pocket. Leaving them on the floor is quite convenient alhumdulillah. Kashif Wa Salaam |
| NS |
| Re: The non-Objective Religion |
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| amatullah |
| 07/20/01 at 13:56:56 |
| Bismillah and salam, Just a suggestion, why do we have to argue whether it is ok islamicaly or not? why don't the men put these things all on one desk when they first walk in? I think it is important to help each other concentrate better in salat. The prophet pbuh was bothered by some pattern on his cloth. not to mention all sorts of objects infront of us. The ladies don't put their purses between each other, we leave them all on a table or against the back wall. And alhemdulilah we don't pick our toes, ears and noses and then come to shake hands, hug and say salams :) This is from another thread: A'isha (radhiAllaahu 'anha) said that (once) the Messenger of Allaah (sallallaahu 'alaihi wa sallam) prayed in a woollen garment which had markings on it. When he finished his prayer he said, "Go to Abu Jahm ibn Hudhaifah with this garment and bring me an inbijaaniyyah, because this has distracted me too much in my prayer." [Bukhaari, Muslim, Nisai, Ibn Maajah, Muatta of Maalik] The inbijaaniyyah that the Messenger of Allaah (sallallaahu 'alaihi wa sallam) desired is a thick garment which has no markings or pattern on it unlike the khameesah (woollen garment which he was wearing at the time) which he rejected and it had such markings. And patterns are more preferable than pictures. |
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