A R C H I V E S
Madinat al-Muslimeen Islamic Message Board
| What could be more annoying? |
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| Madani |
| 06/10/02 at 00:27:56 |
| [slm] In sha Allah, some of you may have heard about the 'grand opening' of AlMaghrib Institute. In sha Allah, I would like anyones feedback on what does NOT work in Islamic seminars. What is the most annoying things that happen to you when you attend a lecture. For example, if I attend a class and the speaker is just repeating himself over and over again, I think, "Ok, I got that point, can I leave now if you're not going to say anything new." In sha Allah, let's gather our thoughts so that we can make a difference here in North America in the quality of our classes. Everyones input is important and valuable to me. Your brother, Muhammad Alshareef www.alMaghrib.org |
| Re: What could be more annoying? |
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| jaihoon |
| 06/10/02 at 01:47:56 |
| * use local examples * don't make the listener feel sorry for attending the talk: as if he has to recite the kalima again! * talk +ve stuff. More on sunnah and less on bid'ah * help the audience to consolidate his/her faith; not let him leave the assembly in a confused state * induce a state of spirituality in the audience: that they are seated in an assembly filled with angels (since an islamic gethering), and not just another talk show * remind them that it is Allah's mercy upon them that drove them to attend the meet * and to recite [saw] whenever that blessed name is pronounced - so that they continue to be blessed by Allah tenfold as long as they are in the assembly. So far... so much 8) ... - JAIHOON ;) http://jaihoon.com |
| 06/10/02 at 01:48:55 |
| jaihoon |
| Re: What could be more annoying? |
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| Madani |
| 06/10/02 at 02:05:12 |
| Jazak Allahu Khary bro for your input. [quote]* use local examples [/quote] What do you mean? [quote]* talk +ve stuff. More on sunnah and less on bid'ah [/quote] I totally agree with you. When I give a talk, I do not waste time telling people what is wrong. Instead, I'll spend their time telling them what the Sunnah tells them to do. Why would I make myself a spokesperson for the wrong? Ya'know what i mean. Interestingly, I was reading a book on how the mind works, and the author was mentioning a task she would ask of her students. She would say, "Do not think of a cat chasing a mouse." She went oj to explain that it is [i]impossible[/i] to do that. You must first think of a cat chasing a mouse and then put a big 'no-smoking' red slash through the image. If you think of a cat sleeping or doing something else, you are not actually thinking of a cat 'not' chasing a mouse. You are just imagining something else. So when someone tells people 'don't do this', in reality they are causing the person to imagine how to do something wrong. If this is all they get the entire lecture, then the student will only know how to do something in the incorrect way. Hmm.. Anyone else? - Muhammad Alshareef www.AlMaghrib.org |
| Re: What could be more annoying? |
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| jaihoon |
| 06/10/02 at 02:21:10 |
| by local examples, i meant that when reasoning something, use an example that is familiar to the audience, say the place, name etc. |
| Re: What could be more annoying? |
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| jannah |
| 06/10/02 at 02:49:32 |
| [wlm] hmm annoying: -- starting the talk with dear brothers... and peppering talk with the believer, he should be this and he is great and he should do his prayers.. etc. alot of books do this esp translations! --dwelving into fiqhi issues.. ie sisters and brothers mixing is haram, praying late is haram, using the internet is haram etc etc -- too much arabic... when most ppl don't understand it. esp when speaker is teaching from a book-- sometimes the speaker will read from the book, paragraphs literally in arabic and then translate haltingly and then expand into the points. this is really nice if you know arabic. it completely loses your attention and points when the audience doesn't have a clue. nice: -- giving examples that we can understand - personal experiences, things related to student univ life, life on the job living in the US etc --ecouraging or giving ppl ideas on how to really practically improve themselves. --to give out any written material that goes with the class, or inform everyone on the book being used so we can buy it before the class and have it during the class to use as reference. btw i hope their are plans to design a good evaluation sheet to give out to participants after.. |
| Re: What could be more annoying? |
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| sis |
| 06/10/02 at 06:21:09 |
| alsalamu alaykum wa rhmat Allah wa barakatuhu one thing that i notice the majority getting cranky about at lectures is the timing....everyone tends to do the 'the muslim standard time' thing where if the lecture has been set for say 6..they show at 6:15 and then it doesn't start until 6:30 or it can go even later ....lectures should begin latest 15 minutes after they're scheduled time...it would be fair for those that make the effort to be there on time and it would teach the late comers a lesson insha'Allah also..sometimes when lectures are long-maybe more than 2hrs...people tend to get restless and won't pay attention as much...either have a 5-10 minute break somewhere in the middle for long lectures or make sure that at some point it gets interactive..ie. the speaker may ask a question and then get the audience to contribute etc.... oh and another thing is to make an effort to bring local speakers in....the big names do bring big numbers out and all...but when a community comes to know that it has knowledgeble members, it acts like a constant motivator i hope none of that was confusing..and that there was something useful in it insha'Allah walsalamu alaykum wa rhmat Allah wa barakatuhu |
| Re: What could be more annoying? |
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| Change |
| 06/10/02 at 14:15:46 |
| salam This is an important topic. There are people who are good speakers and then there are people who are not. The speaker should be aware of the audience who his speech is intended for. I don't like it when a speaker gets on the mic and screams at the top of his lungs and uses examples that you can't relate to, like for instance muslims who go clubbing, then I just feel like I'm being reproached for something I do not do. One other thing I can't stand is when speakers speak of other people in unfavourable manner, like it's an absolute necessity you have to witness what they are saying. |
| Re: What could be more annoying? |
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| Madani |
| 06/10/02 at 15:39:38 |
| Also, while we are listing those annoying things, how about some things that really impressed you while attending some past events. What really had an effect on you? Anyone? |
| Re: What could be more annoying? |
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| Kashif |
| 06/10/02 at 19:37:07 |
| assalaamu alaikum - Lengthy introductions can be annoying. - Often i'd like to forego the question and answer sessions if the speaker has more lecture material to cover. Perhaps in programmes where there are a series of lectures, then you can have x number of straight lectures, followed by an end session devoted entirely to questions that have arisen during the course of all the lectures. - lecture halls getting too hot and stuffy Kashif Wa Salaam |
| NS |
| Re: What could be more annoying? |
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| talib_ilm |
| 06/10/02 at 21:28:34 |
| Assalam Alaykum Waramatullah, -: The lectures should not always be about our problems and the downfall of the muslims. It is difficult not to feel disheartened about the whole situation in which the muslims are in. Sometimes we need to be uplifted with the basheer (glad tidings) of Allah (swt). -: The lecture should be at the level inwhich the audience can understand. +: The lecture should include examples that the people are familar with. +: Unlike sis jannah, I think lectures should use more arabic words, I find it very helpful as I learn the arabic language. Although this should be done in a systematic way to avoid pushing the audience way rather than drawing them closer. +: If it is an all arabic or urdu lecture, the speaker should ensure there is proper translation for those who do not understand the language. This is sometimes neglected...but it I feel it is very important. +: The lectures should have more of the sunnah and the seerah of the prophet. Many people know who chelsea clinton is but when you ask who was the first wife of the Prophet(saw) after the death of Khadijah (ra) they say Aisha(rah). So lectures should at least mention something about our prophets (saw) life. InshaAllah, I hope this is helpful. Ma Salam AbdulKareem |
| Re: What could be more annoying? |
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| ahmer |
| 06/10/02 at 22:42:21 |
| [slm] there may be some redundancy in the ideas, but in my humble opinion.. - Often the lectures ride on an emotional crest, which just die down as the high waves on the sea shore, i truly understand that it is important to wake up the listeners from slumber, but right after these crests, the speaker should tell the listeners what to do? how can you solve the problems on campus, how do you interact,etc - from what i have seen on campus, speakers come and they just talk without using any visual aids, the Prophet (saws) once was sitting with the companions and he drew different lines on the sand, and explained them key islamic concepts using those lines. I think that was the first ever 'powerpoint' presentation :).. but the point is that speakers should use these tools existing on every campus. Every classroom in our school has a computer cart which can always be used and yet no speaker ever used it. - Another great technique is 'analogies', How many times Allah has used analogies (infinite!!!) to explain stuff in the Quran and we find it sooo much in Hadiths as well.. The speakers can perfectly relate to the problems/solutions by giving analogies that are from this time/place and conditions (examples & analogies, not from 1000 miles away that are soo difficult to relate or understand) - I have been a witness to myself and other people doing soo much activism in MSAs and yet we are sooo deeply bereft of spirituality, The speakers talk a lot in worldly terms and yet do not emphasize on how to control your nafs, how to elevate onself in good deeds, how to immerse onself in ihsan, the immense value of dhikr etc. This deficiency leads to a state of burnt out activism (which is more like a ship without a rudder) and when someone tries to tell us that this should go first, we have a flawed logic to tell 'Doing stuff is important!!'. The speaker should give a heavy dose of spirituality that helps his soul reach excellence. - Last but not the least, any lecture should end with a strong recommendation of a book, or an article so that the benefits of the lecture continue beyond the lecture itself i had more but insha'Allah some other time.. jazaka'Allah Br Shareef for listening patiently as you always do in your lectures..:) ma'salama ahmer |
| Re: What could be more annoying? |
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| jaihoon |
| 06/11/02 at 00:07:01 |
| [quote] the Prophet (saws) once was sitting with the companions and he drew different lines on the sand, and explained them key islamic concepts using those lines. I think that was the first ever 'powerpoint' presentation [/quote] Masha Allah! I have never given this a serious thought. That was a brilliant point! jazak Allah for mentioning it. [quote] - I have been a witness to myself and other people doing soo much activism in MSAs and yet we are sooo deeply bereft of spirituality, The speakers talk a lot in worldly terms and yet do not ...The speaker should give a heavy dose of spirituality that helps his soul reach excellence. [/quote] very much true :( . |
| 06/11/02 at 16:14:08 |
| jannah |
| Re: What could be more annoying? |
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| Kathy |
| 06/11/02 at 09:07:34 |
| [slm] From my experiences: Positive- A power point presentation. Food/drink. Speaker looking over at the women- instead of ignoring them the whole lecture. A person using an Arabic term- immediately following it with the English translation. Using a story/example for each important point. Humor- too! A contact phone number/e-mail. If the lecture is for an American audience- go over the lecture with an American so they can point out any potential hot spots- or sayings. There are cultural differences. Dress smart. Polish up your accent. Ask for help in pronunciation -prior. Have different reference materials for different levels of understanding. Get some babysitters. I also think that if you are co-lecturing- you should not 'correct' your partner unless it is shirk- or damaging to the image of Islam. Question and Answer period. If there is answer and question period learn to: Understand & Answer the question they are asking. Be prepared to "shut up" [i](ok- strong word- but for the lack of breeding- I can't think of another!)[/i] a) the person who is giving a self propogating speech. b) the person who has been scorned by a Muslim and wants to vent. c) the person who is missing the point all together. d) the person who has come- to show you the right religion. e) the Muslim who wants to argue your points f) the person who just can't understand cultural/ govermental Islam and the real Islam. Negative- Speaker using a forceful voice &/or being condescending. Kids running around. Room too hot. Speaker not answering or asking for questions from the Sisters side. Refering to the Sister's questions as a complaint- instead of as a concern. Someone setting up refreshments during the lecture. Not lecturing on the Topics Subject. Turn off the cell phone! I did not give reasons/ examples- but will if you want. |
| Re: What could be more annoying? |
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| AyeshaZ |
| 06/11/02 at 16:11:09 |
Asalamu Alykum, ~Never have a lecture/deen intensive near a subway station.. The whole auditorium starts to shake and after the 5th time you know its not thunder :) ~ The speaker being organized and not like mentioning million things in one sentence. ~Also finishing the lecture by emphasizing on how do we take all this info and implement it in our lives ( sometimes its very obvious). JazakumAllahu khair |
| Re: What could be more annoying? |
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| wired-up |
| 06/12/02 at 07:16:32 |
| Assalamualaikum Warahmatullah Also, while we are listing those annoying things, how about some things that really impressed you while attending some past events. What really had an effect on you? Anyone? Brother One of the BEST things about an ijtimaa or lecture is Duaa at the end .Its the most beautiful ending to give to an Islamic talk .Duaa recited in Arabic in the beginning and then in local language.It should be atleast for five minutes .Begging Allah (Swt) to bless the lecture ,forgive shortcomings of everyone etc etc. My daad says that some people who can't make it to the ijtimaa try best to attend the duaa in the end if only that . A moving ,soul-searching duaa at the end by the speaker . :) AssalamualaikumWarahmatullah |
| Re: What could be more annoying? |
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| haaris |
| 06/12/02 at 09:41:13 |
| [slm] Most of the good points have been raised by the brothers and sisters already, but here are some of my "do"s and "don't"s. Do Be aware of your own vocal qualities. Pitch your volume at an appropriate level so that all can hear but none are deafened. We all have an accent. The audience may or may not be familiar with yours, so you might need to enunciate more clearly for their benefit. Have a structure for a talk and stick to it. Introduce it at the beginning of the talk so that the audience knows where you are going, so to speak. Don't Quote Qur'an or hadith extensively without providing a reference to allow the audience to revisit that source. If possible, provide a list of passages, etc that you have quoted at the end. It drives me mad if I'm listening to a speaker and following his discussion but then, a few days later, forget an element of the talk and don't know where to find the ayah or hadith in question to jog my memory. Finish a talk without having conveyed the key points of it. But, hey, just my opinion. By the way, good to have you back Bro Madani; haven't seen you around for a while. Busy, I see ... |
| Re: What could be more annoying? |
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| Nazia |
| 06/12/02 at 17:12:30 |
| [quote]Also, while we are listing those annoying things, how about some things that really impressed you while attending some past events. [/quote] Depending on the audience, I would say that stories are a GREAT way to bring a topic home. This is not dissimilar from the other reponses people gave regarding using examples that one can relate to etc. But even more so than examples, etc...I love stories that make you think. Any of you who attended Imam Siraj Wahaj's Sunday's MYNA lecture at ISNA last year might remember this: The speech dealt with self purification and the like...a nice topic for an audience comprised mostly of high school kids (and the occasional college kid) He started telling us the story of an Imam who was desperately trying to prepare for his Jumma Khutbah. His wife was out of the house, so he was also caring for and watching after their young 4-5 year old son who was constantly wanting his attention. So finally, the Imam found a map of the world, shred it up into many pieces and told his son to put it all back together like a puzzle. Excitedly, the young boy, tape in had, began working on this arduous task. Figuring he had bought himself atleast a couple of hours, the Imam went back to his study to prepare his khutbah. However, to his surprise, within minutes the son returned with the map fully intact. All the countries were lined up properly and everything seemed to be more or less in place. Perplexed and confused, the father asked, "HOW could you have possibly completed this puzzle so quickly??" And the son replied, "It was easy. You see, on the back of the map, there is a picture of a man. [i]And when I fixed the man, the world just fixed itself [/i]" And his father smiled and thought to himself....we fix ourselves, and the world will itself become fixed. So he turned to his son and said, "Son, you just wrote my khutbah for me." :) Isn't that so sweet?? Anyways, I thought the story was cute and sent out a very loud message that is actually one of the fundamental teachings of our religion--self-purification. The young audience also seemed to love it. So anyways, to make a long answer short---stories with a moral are always a plus! Take Care, Wassalam, Nazia |
| Re: What could be more annoying? |
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| Madani |
| 06/12/02 at 23:51:14 |
| [quote]By the way, good to have you back Bro Madani; haven't seen you around for a while. [/quote] Jazak Allahu Khayr Haaris for the welcome. It's always a warm feeling to visit Jannah.org . I feel like I'm travelling really far, like from Washington to Albany or something :P Anyhow, you said: [quote]Don't Quote Qur'an or hadith extensively without providing a reference to allow the audience to revisit that source. [/quote] I was wondering about that. How many people actually write down the reference numbers? In the middle of a Khutbah, sometimes it is distracting to mention the 'footnotes'. Then I was like, well who is really going to remember anyhow so why mess up the flow of thoughts. Of course in written form I would mention them. What does everyone else think? Other thoughts? Jazakillaahu Khayr sister Nazia. I have grown to realize the power of the 'story'. It captures peoples attention and holds it for a long time. Not only that, but the audience remembers the whole story (like you remembered). I'm sure many of those who attended probably forgot much of Imam Sirajs 'words' in his speech, but it is the stories that linger. And the nice thing about the stories is that everyone can extract their own lessons from it. - Muhammad Alshareef [color=Brown]www.alMaghrib.org[/color] |
| Re: What could be more annoying? |
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| momineqbal |
| 06/13/02 at 01:57:23 |
| [slm], [quote]Don't Quote Qur'an or hadith extensively without providing a reference to allow the audience to revisit that source. [/quote] I like this idea. The way Dr. Zakir Naik does this should be the way to do it (providing the reference before quoting it). I can remember at least a few of the quotes, at least the surah names and sometimes would go and look it up especially when I am conveying what I heard to someone else. But again different speakers have different styles, so maybe its worth to experiment this and take it if it suits the style of the speaker. Eqbal |
| 06/13/02 at 01:59:42 |
| momineqbal |
| Re: What could be more annoying? |
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| UmmAbdulRahman |
| 06/13/02 at 20:29:32 |
| [slm] There's nothing that captures my attention more than when a speaker starts with a story (guess I'm a kid at heart ;) ) It doesn't necessarily have to be a story from the seerah of prophet [saw] or a story of a companion (not at all meaning to downplay the importance of those lessons), but maybe even a story from our own communities and our own lives. Of course, the story should be relevant to the topic at hand and serve to illustrate an important point about where the lecture is going. |
| Re: What could be more annoying? |
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| se7en |
| 06/26/02 at 15:52:12 |
as salaamu alaykum wa rahmatAllah, a few suggestions I would make.. - always repeat questions that are asked by audience members. usually half the people in the audience don't hear it and spend the next five minutes trying to figure out what it was :) - don't hesitate to tell people to be quiet, stop moving in and out, turn off their cell phones, etc. if it's distracting to you as the speaker it's most definitely distracting your students, though they don't have the ability to say anything about it. - for a seminar, i think it's a good idea to give people an overview of how the day is structured, when breaks will be, how the material will be covered etc. Having an overview makes it easier as a student to go into an eight/nine hour day of study. - keep questions until the end, unless it's a matter of clarification. i also agree with kathy in that sometimes you just have to cut people off when their question are actually rants/comments/criticism etc. also don't hesitate to tell people if their question is off topic and that they should address it to you at a later time, because a lot of times questions like that lead to a total derailing of the subject at hand, and issues more relevant are not addressed. - make yourself available for both brothers and sisters to approach on a one on one basis. it's very cool when a speaker says 'feel free to approach me during lunch' or something like that, so that if a question is of a more personal nature, or people are just shy, they still have the opportunity to have their concerns addressed. - if you're quoting something, please say it slowly and repeat. - using numbers ("I'll mention five things that are relevant to this..") makes it easier for a student to make sure they've understood/noted all the information being taught. - short, frequent breaks are better than occasional long ones. ten minutes every hour/hour and a half is a good amount of time to keep people refreshed but still focused. - if you mention something that the audience is very affected by, please don't hesitate to dwell longer on that, or give a break immediately at that time, to allow it to seep in and for people to contemplate on it longer. i know there is a certain amount of material that needs to be covered, but also important is to have this knowledge move from the mind to the heart; so if something in particular engenders that please don't hesitate to facilitate it. - visual aids are good. no need to get all high tech, but writing key terms on a board are helpful :) - keep lectures punctual and on schedule. if you want to go over time, it's nice for the speaker to note that they're doing that, and to give permission to those who have to leave. ("I'm going to take a half hour over time here to go into more detail on this, but if you need to leave at this time, please feel free.") - if the course is over more than one day, choose a student to present a summary of the material that was taught the day before. Hearing the knowledge in a concise format and from someone else's perspective really helps. hmm.. that's all I can think of for now :) this is mostly from my experience with sh. mokhtar's seminars. wAllahu a'lam. wasalaamu alaykum wa rahmatAllah :) |
| 06/26/02 at 15:58:59 |
| se7en |
| Re: What could be more annoying? |
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| sista |
| 07/01/02 at 11:23:58 |
| [slm] I remember sitting in a lecture theatre once, tired, cold, impatient for the speaker to come. I was not practising, I was fed up with having to conform to the world's mad pace every day, and none too keen on listening to 'another preacher' rattle on about how time is running out and we should repent etc etc before it was too late. Yet still I was there, compelled by a drive I could not understand then, hoping to find...what? Peace - of mind, heart and body, although I did not know it then. The speaker entered, more or less on time for once. He was short, stocky, unremarkable...except that I felt deeply moved when I saw him enter, and wanted to cry when I heard him speak. Why? Because he had a rare quality that cut through the impatient, confused layers that society places over the heart - he obviously cared deeply about each and every one of us in that hall. He spoke softly, often smiling though seldom laughing, he asked people's names when addressing them, always giving them his full attention and never patronising them, he encouraged people to communicate with each other as well that unity and brotherhood might flourish even for the short time we were together. And he managed to cover the topic in hand thoroughly. I think that made all the difference - for once I was not made to feel like some miserable sinner on her way to Hell, nor was I made restless and confused by a speaker's words that I could neither deny nor act on, but instead I was shown, I suppose, instead of told, that it wasnt so hard to come back to Allah... "A teacher who walks in the shadow of the temple Among his followers Gives not of his wisdom but rather Of his faith and his lovingness. If he is indeed wise he does not bid you to enter The house of his wisdom But rather leads you To the threshold of your own mind." [wlm] |
| Re: What could be more annoying? |
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| Anonymous |
| 07/03/02 at 12:33:06 |
| Salaam, From my experience, what "annoys" me, if anything: -Speaker doesn't seem to care about what s/he is talking about -Speaker is too time-obsessed. -Speaker thinks s/he is "above" the audience -Speaker makes sweeping generalizations about groups of people (whether against Muslims or non-Muslims) -Speaker has an annoying voice or personality (all relative, I realize) What "moved" me: -Speaker genuinely cared about what s/he was talking about and did not "lecture", but rather, gave sincere naseehah that helped him/her/others out. -Speaker took the time to really research/educate him/herself and give daleel/proof for their statements (if it's more of a fiqh-type lecture). -Speaker was well-liked by the audience. S/he could be an "unknown", but as long as Allah has blessed them with nur, love for Allah and love for others (and others' love for him/her), the audience will know it and remember it. In fact, it doesn't matter what the topic is, the audience will be more engaged if they like the speaker. And it's not about popularity, really (in terms of "big names"). May Allah bless you in your efforts. |
| Re: What could be more annoying? |
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| Khuram |
| 07/09/02 at 00:47:56 |
| Salams folks, The kewl thing you can do in your speach: Talk about Winnipeg! you can do it Muhammad, i know you want to! (be nice though) 8) Khuram |
| Re: What could be more annoying? |
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| UmmZaid |
| 07/11/02 at 01:32:26 |
| Salaam 'Alaikum Positive: -- Speaker is patient and speaks clearly. Shows concern for people in the back who may not be able to hear as well. -- Speaker and organizers have realized that children are a very real possibility for any event that Muslim women are attending, and have tried to facilitate their presence with snackvendors or an area where they can sit. MSAs need to get on the ball with this. Don't make Muslim women from outside the University feel unwelcome b/c they have had to bring their children with them when they are trying to pursue knowledge of the diyn. Ustadh 'Abdullah Adhami was always an expert at handling children at lectures, and I am always grateful to him for "rescuing" the mothers like myself who got dirty looks from fellow Muslims for bringing kids to lectures. -- Speaker has a sense of humor and utlilizes it during the speech. -- As others have said, speaker ACKNOWLEDGES the presence of the women (other than to tell them to cover up or to move away from the men or something). -- Question and Answer segments when the questions are on a piece of paper. Giving people access to the mic opens you up for contentiousness, people who want to lecture the lecturer, etc. Bonus: if the speaker gets the question on paper, (s)he has to read the question out loud, and that way everyone (including the people who buy the tape later) knows what the question was. -- When the adhan and break for prayer is made in advance, so that people who need to have time to make wudhu and don't have to miss the prayer or part of it. -- When breaks for snacks or lunch / dinner are scheduled. Negatives: -- Let's start on time. -- Although a lot of people, incl. me, mentioned starting on time, ENDING on time is also a problem. A lot of the lectures, esp. the big programs, go OVER the stated time and this creates problems for people who have to take public transportation, or who arrive home much later than they planned to. -- Make sure the sisters have adequate, clean, well-heated (or cooled) spaces to sit. Make sure there is room for children. -- On a personal note, I am very tired of lectures about how the Muslim Ummah will rise again if we all just become doctors and engineers. -- As others said, relevance, relevance, relevance. Of course, spiritual and fiqh matters transcend nationalities, but if someone's coming from another country, they may not understand real experiences here in the West, or relate to the way that we express ourselves. -- Let's not be afraid to tell people to turn off the cell phones or stop talking during the lecture or du'a or nasheeds portions. -- Encourage people to remain in their seats for the du'a. I'm still shocked that people will get up and walk out as soon as Big Name Speaker finishes, instead of staying for the du'a!! I feel like... Well why did you come? -- About the kids, again, on the flip side, poorly behaved children. I no longer attend the durus at our masjid b/c parents cease all discipline of the children as soon as they cross the threshold into the building. :( -- More lectures of issues relevant to women, but addressed to the general audience. Issues of family life and children and marriage and hijab shouldn't be limited to "special sessions." I wish speakers would remember to address the sisters as well as the brothers, and include examples of women in their speeches or stories. -- Speeches about da'wa to the "real America." I read these da'wa books in the Islamic bookstore, but Wallahi, I don't know any Christians like that (taking the Bible seriously and literally and all, though I know they exist). Da'wa books sold here seem to be written by people who don't actually live here and have no experience with real Americans. I wish someone would write a book or give a lecture series on how to give da'wa to some of the real people here -- atheists, agnostics, Wiccans, Christians who don't take the Bible literally, nominal Christians, Universalists, and so on. I guess the Ahmed Deedat - Swaggart-style debates are fun for some people to watch, or may be illuminating for that small percentage of Christians who take the Bible literally, but so many American people totally do not relate to that at all. --Discourage the fashion and flirt show, but don't turn it into a banging of the lectern and screaming at the brothers and sisters about the evils of zina and the Hellfire. Brothers and sisters can be seperated and reminded of the lowering of the gaze without shaming them as though they are three year olds. |
| Re: What could be more annoying? |
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| UmmZaid |
| 07/11/02 at 01:45:45 |
| A few more things... On the lectures, please tell people the sura and aya of the Qur'an that will be recited BEFORE the recitation begins. Sometimes, they don't even tell you at all, and you feel really dumb for not knowing. OK, moving onto seminars, these are my experiences as a student, and as an organizer. -- Make sure there is adequate break time. Students need to stretch their legs and get some fresh air if they are sitting for four, five, six hours a day. -- Make sure everyone knows where the bathroom is. -- If you're organizing, make sure to try and get the names, phone #s, e-mails of the people attending the class so you can reach them in an emergency (class is canceled or something). -- If you're organizing, make sure you get their physician's phone #, emergency contact #s, and any medical conditions you should know about... BEFORE Student X has a low blood sugar episode and you don't know what you can give him and you don't know who his doctor is. Alhamdulilah, we didn't have to use anyone's emergency contact information, but you know, better safe than sorry. -- If you're a student... please, remember to keep the area clean when you leave. I was mortified for our shayukh to see the area after the students (the women students!) left and it was filled with scraps of paper, cups, water bottles, and so on. &jbsp;The organizers are not your mother, and they probably have enough work to do without cleaning up after you. -- If you're a student, have patience. The organizers probably have families and jobs they must also attend to. The organization is probably operating on a tight budget, and they are most likely doing the best they can with what they have. -- If you're an organizer, do your best to make sure that children can be accomodated (they have a place to play or something). The Muslim mothers out there are starving for Islamic knowledge, and we need to try and facilitate them and be patient with their circumstances, since they are responsible for passing the knowledge onto the next generation. -- If you're a student, ask permission before you start taping the class. |
| Re: What could be more annoying? |
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| bhaloo |
| 07/11/02 at 01:48:51 |
| [slm] [quote author=UmmZaid link=board=madrasa;num=1023727975;start=15#24 date=07/11/02 at 01:32:26]Da'wa books sold here seem to be written by people who don't actually live here and have no experience with real Americans. [/quote] You might want to check out Yahiya Emerick (a revert to Islam), I really enjoy his books, he's the author of What Islam is All About and Islam for dummies. [quote] -- On a personal note, I am very tired of lectures about how the Muslim Ummah will rise again if we all just become doctors and engineers. [/quote] I thought lectures typically emphasize that Muslims need to get into other fields, besides the typical ones, doctors, lawyers and engineers? ??? |
| Re: What could be more annoying? |
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| dirt |
| 07/11/02 at 05:29:38 |
| [slm] As for muslims getting into other fields...I think a lot of the problem stems from cultural ties and expectations. Too many people think that anything "less" than a doctor or engineer is somehow almost shameful. And oh have mercy on you if you don't have a degree. Too often people equate education, earnings, job title, and social status with the level of Iman and quality of a person. Sorry, don't mean to get off topic here. [wlm] |
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| deenb4dunya |
| 07/11/02 at 17:13:26 |
| Try not to go off topic as much as possible. INshallah I plan to attend the tafseer wshop in August in Ottawa- I think its' a bit expensive thought- its 250$ Canadian.... Br. Muhammed...you used to live in Winnipeg and Ottawa...you know how sucky the Canadian dollar is...you should gie us a break man! :'( Jazakallahu khayran. one more thing0 is any prep required b4 the workshop? deen |
| Re: What could be more annoying? |
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| Madani |
| 07/11/02 at 18:13:02 |
| [quote]Br. Muhammed...you used to live in Winnipeg and Ottawa...you know how sucky the Canadian dollar is :P[/quote] wa alaykum as salam sista, I hear what you're saying. I know too well how sucky the Canadian dollar is. I was shocked when I first saw the conversion. Problem is is that AlMaghrib Institute is a University program. I personally spoke to the Dean of the American Open University about Ottawa, and Ottawa specifically. Unfortunately, the course prices are set to be fair for everyone that studies at the American Open University. The course, through correspondence, actually costs $200 US, but for the AlMaghrib accredited intensive, we are getting it for $165 per student since it is a special program, alhamdulillah. Our apartments in Maryland are like above $900. So $165 actually isn't bad for us. In Winnipeg, however, I used to have 14 Canadian dollars in my Royal Bank account. It would last me for like 3 years. :) I am here in Ottawa right now and my plan is to speak to some local organizations to make an effort to sponsor their youth. We have about 4 organizations that are sponsoring about 10 students right now (that's before my arrival) and in sha Allah, I'm trying to get more. Instead of them paying full scholarship, I was hoping to encourage them to give half scholarships so that more people could benefit. In sha Allah, I hope they shall warm to the idea. As one of the scholars of the past said, "When I was young my father gave me 100 thousand dinars. And then he said to me, 'Here is 100 thousand dinars - now go. I do not want to see you back here until you replace it with 100 thousand hadith." May Allah make every dollar you spend in this noble path written for you with Allah. If there is anyway we can assist you in the payment (like post dated checks or a monthly plan), just let us know. Sorry everyone, we went a little off topic, but perhaps someone might take note of how we are trying to overcome the dilemna of bringing larger programs such as this to smaller locations. Anyone else with suggestions? - Muhammad Alshareef www.AlMaghrib.org |
| Re: What could be more annoying? |
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| Madani |
| 07/12/02 at 06:04:15 |
| [quote]one more thing is any prep required b4 the workshop? [/quote] We put up a student center on our website that has all the prep materials. It's at: www.alMaghrib.org >> student center We give suggestions on how our students can prepare with reading materials, how to prepare mentally, and how to prepare spiritually. This is so that our students come to the double-weekend accredited intensive prepared ahead of time. Hope you do well. - Muhammad Alshareef To everyone: The student center at our website is to get the students ready for the course before they arrive. If there are any MYNA or youth programs in your area, you are welcome to copy our 'how to prepare' design. ;) |
| Re: What could be more annoying? |
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| AyeshaZ |
| 07/12/02 at 14:54:25 |
| [quote author=Madani link=board=madrasa;num=1023727975;start=30#30 date=07/12/02 at 06:04:15] To everyone: The student center at our website is to get the students ready for the course before they arrive. If there are any MYNA or youth programs in your area, you are welcome to copy our 'how to prepare' design. ;) [/quote] JazakumAllahu khair sidi Muhammad Alshareef, we are definitely gonna use this resource. |
| Re: What could be more annoying? |
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| deenb4dunya |
| 07/13/02 at 23:22:26 |
| hMMMMM.... WHY DO ALL OF SE7EN'S SUGGESTIONS SOUND FAMILIAR??? ;) |
| Re: What could be more annoying? |
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| UmmZaid |
| 07/14/02 at 02:28:42 |
| You might want to check out Yahiya Emerick (a revert to Islam), I really enjoy his books, he's the author of What Islam is All About and Islam for dummies.<< Yes, I had his da'wa book (I gave it to someone I think), and I have met him, and he's very good, mash'Allah. But we need more like that. Even the da'wa books aimed at Christians, were I to give that to any Christian relatives or friends of mine, they would feel their intelligence was being insulted by some of the assumptions in the books. IME & O. >>I thought lectures typically emphasize that Muslims need to get into other fields, besides the typical ones, doctors, lawyers and engineers? ???<< TBH, I've heard this maybe once or twice. And it's always from the same people. Maybe soon, however, this message will begin to reach into the minds of the audience. I was at a lecture w/ a sheikh, and he was talking about making sure your children are raised around Muslims, and learning Shari'a, and so on, and this guy stood up in the audience, and said, "But we need to learn engineering and medicine." And the sheikh said, "Don't we have enough engineers and doctors?" And the brother said, "We need more, how else will we beat the kafirs?" You should have seen the look on the sheikh's face. I can't remember what he said in response, but I remembering thinking, "Wallah, we won't "beat them" at akhira by only studying engineering and medicine." |
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