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Madinat al-Muslimeen Islamic Message Board
| "your people" |
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| mwishka |
| 06/20/02 at 10:14:37 |
| my friends, though this sounds like a personal thing, i'm putting it here because it is actually not at all personal, it's at the crux of the issues facing the whole of the ummah, the whole of islam in every facet, and the whole of the lives of every muslim on the planet. i just received this from a friend. he's a brilliant man i greatly respect, whose background is nuclear physics, and who is, like myself, a lover of science. he's a researcher for a giant US company, working in science for the good of all people, his own work being on methods of detecting flaws in metals "in the field", such as in bridge supports. as you can see, his perspective on islam and muslims has strangely incorporated far flung elements which have no relation to one another into a weave of diabolical activity which he feels, as do many many other americans, threatens our very lives. you must take very seriously the ways in which islam is being misrepresented and the extent to which americans are NOT getting accurate information. americans tend to have to work on just causes on their own, and even the groups which form to work together frequently fail to make headway because of internal fighting and disagreements, combined with power struggles and unwillingness to cooperate. you can't let this be what keeps islam from becoming widely understood, instead of being so widely misunderstood. i've had discussions with this friend - he has virtually closed his mind to any ideas other than the ones he already holds. i remember in 7th grade math class first encountering the term idee fixee, a "fixed idea", one that traps you into a mistaken way of thinking and keeps you from going forward. we all have our own traps like this, but some are innocuous and some are quite dangerous. the ummah has, as i see it, decades of reparation to make before it can once again take its proper respected place in the world, based on its own honor as a body of people and ideas. it can't allow itself to become trapped into its own idee fixee of the rest of the world. my friend's message fills me with sadness and hurts me, but it is not unexpected. mwishka :( I'm very dissappointed in you. Wake up. You're living in la-la land. You're being brainwashed by the people that harbored the criminals that committed 911. There are no excuses - no rationalizations. American citizens do not go into Palestine to blow up innocent civilians. Your Muslim extremists kidnapped Daniel Pearl in Pakistan, tortured him, slit his throat, then, with one hand on his hair and the other holding a large knife, sliced through his neck, decapitating him. Then they proudly held up his warm head, eyes closed, mouth limp, blood dripping still. I saw this video. His mother saw this video. You should see it. There lies the truth about "your people". |
| Re: "your people" |
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| ltcorpest2 |
| 06/20/02 at 13:23:55 |
| lets face it, there has been damage to all peoples from all sides and everyone can take any facts and turn them any way they want to. I think one of the greatest needs is for each group of people or religion or society to self police instead of blaming everyone else for attrocities. (your side is worse than our side etc.) |
| Re: "your people" |
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| BroHanif |
| 06/20/02 at 18:35:28 |
| [slm], It is only Allah who guides people. And if your friend gets guidance great but if he dosen't then thats up to Allah. We can try as hard as we want and we should. One of the ways of successful dawah(inviting people) is ones own character. The noble prophet [saw] had the best chracter and if we adopt or use his examplyry life as our way forwar then it will be a win/win situation. Win in this world, win in the next. salaams Hanif |
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| sofia |
| 06/21/02 at 11:39:42 |
| By that logic: I guess Christians are bombers too (OK bombers or uni-bombers). I guess Jews are terrorists who walk into masaajid and kill 20 ppl while they're in prayers...and and and...[Man, this is getting old]. All these things are documented, but obviously not as well documented as crimes committed by Muslims. People are people and religions are religions. *If* religion were to actually promote evil (and not misguided individuals who promote evil), then maybe someone who is seemingly well-educated could make that argument. But as far as I know, the media Islam "experts" are anything but credible teachers. May Allah provide us all with guidance and help us see truth as truth and accept it and see falsehood as falsehood and stay far from it. I do agree with the self-policing, "check yourself before you are checked," as taught by our Prophet, the caliphs, etc etc. And I definitely agree, mwishka, Muslims haven't done very much to spread the truth about what Islam really is vs. how it is portrayed. We're still too reactionary (if that), rather than proactive. So many resources/time/effort we waste! |
| NS |
| 06/21/02 at 11:43:37 |
| sofia |
| Re: "your people" |
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| Traveler |
| 06/21/02 at 16:23:20 |
| [slm] mwhiska, what did your friend mean when he said "your people" in his message? |
| Re: "your people" |
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| mwishka |
| 06/21/02 at 16:50:08 |
| traveler, i understand him to mean "those muslims you've befriended", as well as all other muslims anywhere. a note i'll add to this, which i didn't put in before because i didn't want to emphasize the personal aspects of the message, is that my friend was born in a displaced persons camp after world war II, where his parents were reunited after their release from nazi concentration camps. because his comments here were general about muslims, which has nothing to do with this part of his past or with those who held his parents or those caused the circumstances into which he was born, i didn't want to include this. but his perspective on israel and palestine is tied to these events of his past, and his forever wounded heart, and his bitterness, and his failure to heal or recover from that in his life now. and he has transferred those feelings inappropriately to the palestinian people, the majority of whom are muslim, and subsequently and even MORE inappropriately, to muslims in general. mwishka |
| 06/25/02 at 13:20:17 |
| mwishka |
| Re: "your people" |
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| Halima |
| 06/25/02 at 07:39:11 |
| Mwishka, When you say that he said "those Muslims you've befriended", does this mean you are a non-Mulsim befriending Muslims or are you are a Muslim hence Muslims are regarded as "your people"? But as a Mulsim, other Muslims being referred to "your people" or even being called as "you Muslims" in general should not offend you. Take it in your stride. When you do that, your detractors and enemies will regards you with utmost respect and come to listen to what you have to say about your religion one day INSHA-ALLAH! Never give up hope! Never let narrow minded people get to you. I know that this is easier said than done, but it can be done! This friend who you respect so much should see what is being done to the Palestinians, especially after his experience in the concentration camps. Memories of torture as a child are hell. He can imagine what the Palestinian will feel year from now. He should know, having been there himself. I experienced a lot of hateful words from colleagues after the September 11 attacks. You will think I was not of the pilots in those planes. But I took no bullshit from anybody about my Religion. I fought back just as effectively and today, my colleagues respect me and my belief. And for those who still feel like saying something, they will not do it in front of me. Not because they are afraid of me but because work ethics and the oath of office does not allow or tolerate any kind of discrimination or abuse. The person who did that to me realized the grave mistake he made. There are many ways to address issues concerning Islam and Muslims. But fear will never put Islam and Muslims ahead and neither will it make our critics, enemies and those misguided understand Islam and Muslims better. Fighting back does not necessarily mean with your fists or weapons, NO! There are quiete a number of ways which are just as effective. The point here is to BE PROACTIVE RATHER THAN REACTIVE unless it absolutely necessary to be reactive. Weigh the situation accordingly and decide the best cause of action. Wasalaam. Halima |
| Re: "your people" |
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| mwishka |
| 06/25/02 at 08:35:26 |
| sis halima, nah, i don't get offended by things.... yes, i'm non-muslim and that's why my friend chose this particular wording, which i suppose may be what people who are attempting to "offend" people might use. his mindset saddens me greatly, that he can't get out of it, or see clearly. and yes, anyone who ever, in any way, brings up any question of any nazi activity in relation to anything to do with supporting the current state of israel is failing to see or think clearly if they don't see the direct application of those hateful concepts to palestinian life with the israeli army and breeders of hatred in power in israel. the way this friend thinks relates directly to the way i think our schooling contibutes a great deal to the way we do or don't understand the rest of the world. here is a man who understands that equations are just sentences (the relationship of this to this is that it increases in magnitude as this increases, but decreases as this other thing increases, etc.), but seems to be forgetting to apply that way of thinking to the information he takes in. (if israel says this, but is actually doing this, the level of their honesty can be seen to decrease whenever they address this idea, and you can tell that they only ever express this idea in these particular words to attempt to cause you to accept without question this particular rigid and biased viewpoint of this particular action of theirs, etc.) for most people, i'd say their inability to assess and sort out the information they come across has more to do with their lack of understanding of the structure of equations -- the lack of appropriate training to understand that information is not at all a constant that is unaffected by the rest of the equation, but is just one more very dependent variable that can only be evaluated when all other quantities in the equation are taken into account, and their relationships kept in mind. actually, sis halima, i think i prefer for people to say their hateful things when i am around, so they're not going around saying them secretly. i'd rather counter their ridiculous statements upfront, where those who are listening to them can hear other sides of the questions, rather than have people around me self-censor and so propagate their ignorance of lots of facts by hiding in little "patriotic" (or whatever they think of it as) groups and just reinforcing these misguided notions among themselves. because i think it tends to be that anything you say or hear, no matter how wrong or right, can get really stuck in your mind if you hear only support for those ideas as they are, IF you're not used to remembering to analyze everything for yourself, and IF you're afraid to express an opinion that's going to be taken as unpopular or maybe be attacked. mwishka sorry especially to eleanor, who wishes i'd use more paragraphs but forgot to also request that i stop letting my sentences run on and be too lengthy in general...... ;) |
| Re: "your people" |
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| mwishka |
| 06/25/02 at 13:15:53 |
| for those who have already read my above replies to posts, please note that i'm making a correction in my friend's background above. i remmbered the story as worse than it was. and though this doesn't matter over all, i wouldn't want to leave it uncorrected. mwishka (thanks to 9thM for sending me to re-read something "netted" in a, um search, which straightened out the details of my friend's personal history...) |
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