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Madinat al-Muslimeen Islamic Message Board
| Verse in Qu'ran relating to Adultery |
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| muqaddar |
| 08/07/02 at 13:57:09 |
| [slm] Somebody quoted a verse in the qu'ran where it says only those who commit adultery can marry other adulterers Does this refer to adultery or fornication please? |
| Re: Verse in Qu'ran relating to Adultery |
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| theOriginal |
| 08/07/02 at 14:12:36 |
| [slm] Woah okay, I have never heard that verse, so that was a first. As far as I remember, the Qur'an does mention that "Pure men will get pure women" and vice versa. It goes for impurity as well. Since your question is in regard to the terminology, let's define the two words (source: [url]http://www.dictionary.com[/url]) : Adultery: Voluntary sexual intercourse between a married person and a partner other than the lawful spouse. Fornication: Sexual intercourse between partners who are not married to each other. Therefore, adultery occurs only after someone is already married, whereas the other word is simply not necessarily so. And so, with reference to terminology, I can't imagine how an adulterer can only marry another adulterer, since they are already married. It's a bit of a fallacy. The person who was quoting to you, probably just slipped. (so let it go :) ) Wasalaam, SF. |
| Re: Verse in Qu'ran relating to Adultery |
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| muqaddar |
| 08/07/02 at 14:25:11 |
| [slm] I hope so otherwise it leads to some complex situations say a muslim wants to marry a muslimah who has been commiting fornication he can only marry her if he commits fornication but the adulterer could mean after they have been divorced since you will still be a adulterer. anybody have any fiqh as opposed to english word meaning input? |
| Re: Verse in Qu'ran relating to Adultery |
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| Kathy |
| 08/07/02 at 18:41:56 |
| [slm] Go to Islam Q&A for a fatwa. My understanding is that there are special circumstances for those who repent and never do it again. |
| Re: Verse in Qu'ran relating to Adultery |
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| bhaloo |
| 08/07/02 at 22:29:42 |
| [slm] Insha'Allah this addresses your issue, and there are more responses on the islam-qa.com site as well. Question: Brother I don't know what to do, but I have committed a great sin. I know the concept of confession does not exist in our beautiful religion, but I have committed fornication. I am trying to repent, and trying to ask Allah for his forgiveness. As I was reading Surah Noor, I found out that I can't marry a chaste woman, what should I do. Please pray for me so Allah makes his punishments easy on me in the Hell fire. Answer: Al-hamdu lillaah. 1) Do not despair, for Allaah the Most Exalted and Glorified said (interpretation of the meaning): "Say: Oh my servants who have transgressed against their souls! Despair not of the mercy of Allaah, for Allaah forgives all sins; for He is oft-forgiving, most merciful." [Surah 39,Verse 53] 2) Let your repentance be truly from your heart, and stay away from all sources of temptations. Also, perform many good deeds, as good deeds abrogate the bad ones. 3) If you repent to Allah, you are no longer described as a fornicator (zaani). Therefore, you can marry a chaste woman. 4) The believer has high hope and aspiration for the best from Allaah. He not only asks Allah for making his punishment easy in hellfire, but he also prays to God the Almighty to save him from Hell and award him with paradise for his repentance and good deeds. Islam Q&A Sheikh Muhammed Salih Al-Munajjid (www.islam-qa.com) |
| Re: Verse in Qu'ran relating to Adultery |
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| eleanor |
| 08/08/02 at 04:40:27 |
| [slm] okay I found the verse you were referring to, but you have to look at the hadiths and fatwas for more advice: Surah Al Nur Verses 2,3 The adulterer and the adultress, scourge you each one of them (with) a hundred stripes. And let not pity for the two withhold you from obedience to Allah, if you believe in Allah and the Last Day. And let a party of believers witness their punishment. The adulterer shall not marry save an adultress or an idolatress, and the adultress none shall marry save an adulterer or idolator. All that is forbidden unto believers. Hope this helps |
| Re: Verse in Qu'ran relating to Adultery |
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| muqaddar |
| 08/09/02 at 15:58:31 |
| [slm] Guys now I'm confused ! Do i ask her to repent or ask her to go before a qadi and let herself be whipped? |
| Re: Verse in Qu'ran relating to Adultery |
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| jannah |
| 08/10/02 at 01:45:09 |
| [quote]Do i ask her to repent or ask her to go before a qadi and let herself be whipped? [/quote] what the heck.. since when did England become a Khalifah and introduce Islamic courts and the authority to enforce punishments?? please do tell your friend to repent and please do tell her to go to someone knowledgable. |
| Re: Verse in Qu'ran relating to Adultery |
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| eleanor |
| 08/10/02 at 05:51:24 |
| [slm] umm..by the way a hundred stripes is equivalent to death. It's very rare that anyone lives beyond 50. So yeah, I'd tell her to repent too. |
| Re: Verse in Qu'ran relating to Adultery |
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| muqaddar |
| 08/10/02 at 07:07:11 |
| [slm] Jannah who says you have to go before a court in England? and who says you have to get all your disputes resolved in England? There are still qadi's. The Law does not disappear because a few tyrants say it is their whim that it be so, just as the sea does not stop if they say it The Law is what people believe and practice. The 100 lashes do not have to be applied at once. |
| Re: Verse in Qu'ran relating to Adultery |
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| jannah |
| 08/10/02 at 10:39:29 |
| The point is, it is wrong for someone to take up the mantle of Islamic judge court and jury without the system behind it. Islam is a system. There is no vigilantism in it. |
| Re: Verse in Qu'ran relating to Adultery |
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| muqaddar |
| 08/10/02 at 14:09:29 |
| [slm] beg to differ islam is a community roman law is a system islam is not city states, feudalism, nationalism or any other system it's people who come together because they believe in one god, and put that into practice whether in a house, village or nation |
| Re: Verse in Qu'ran relating to Adultery |
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| SisterHania |
| 08/10/02 at 15:14:28 |
| [slm] Hm I found a collection of fatwas from the European Council for Fatwa and Research Here was a fatwa from page 36: Q) I am a young Muslim who arrived in Germany as an obedient Muslim and remained so for many years. However, I then strayed from the pure path and committed adultery many times with a girlfriend. I kept decending down the path of immorality and wrong doing until I drank alcohol. However since the beginning of the month of Ramadhan, I have made a decision to repent and to return to the ways approved by Allah (swt). Till now, Allh has helped me to remain obedient and I ask Him that my repentance is pure and sincere. I now wish to cleanse myself from the filthiness which I indulged into, and I only wish for a Muslim Caliph to pefom the punishment decreed bY aLLAH (swt) upon me so my body and soul maybe cleansed and purified. I feel anxious that I have committed adultery many times and I do not know how to clease myself from this sin. A) We commend your enthusiasm tor eturn to the straight path and pray that Allah accepts your repentence which is, llah willing, suffice to cleanse you from sins. Make a resolution not to return to your old ways and Allah will help you to suceed and prosper. However, the punishment is not an obligation upon you and it is enough for you to conceal yourself with the cover offered by you by Allah, so do not talk to anyone about your sins and remain determined to abide by your repentance and return to Allah (swt). |
| Re: Verse in Qu'ran relating to Adultery |
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| jannah |
| 08/10/02 at 17:13:49 |
| Sure it's a community. But go ahead and ask any knowledgable faqih if he will implement the punishments of shariah upon you. The look of horror he gives you should be the clue. The Islamic legal system is made up of courts and judges and knowledge, not a bunch of people who take it upon themselves to interpret something they know nothing about. |
| Re: Verse in Qu'ran relating to Adultery |
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| muqaddar |
| 08/10/02 at 19:54:36 |
| [slm] Hmm there's an article in the Economist from about a yaar ago about how after Somalia's descent into warlordism people were setting up sharia courts to implement justice and bring peace, similarly in Chechnya, and now in Falesteen with the collapse of the PA What's your definition of an islamic 'system' ? isn't a qadi sufficient to tell the law? In the absence of the rule of law who has jurisdiction? What happens if the khaleeph lives far away? or if there is no khaleeph? does the Law disappear? The book is complete, and all thats is required is it's implementation upto our abilities Please don't be offended by any of these questions, it's just that i think we should be taking more of a community based view of islamic law than a systems based one. |
| 08/10/02 at 22:02:29 |
| jannah |
| Re: Verse in Qu'ran relating to Adultery |
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| amatullah |
| 08/10/02 at 21:30:51 |
| Bismillah and salam, Muqaddar some good questions but like you said: "i think we should be taking more of a community based view of islamic law than a systems based one. " If we think about what that means if it was to become true, we see that it is imperative that they are educated in Islam and governed by it. A society that doesn't have Allah in their life and less knowledge of deen then traditions, is not one that you can have a minority that apply the islamic law on the rest. It wouldn't work i don't htink. it might even push them away from islam more than make it a reality. In the autobigraphy of Zainab Ilghazaly you can see the Ikhwan planned on a 13 year period of mass education to the public and if by the end of it they do a survey and see that they are still not able to make the apply the islamic law in Masr they will go for another 13 years period again and so on until the society is ready. And during the education they abide by all the islamic behaviour like the alsalaf a-ssali7 did except for iqamat alhudud which are the punishements even though they believe in them. But if the community is misunderstanding as is what is Islam and how to live islamically to begin with, what would the hudud do except alienating those people? So anything community-based looks out for the interest i think of the community and strengthening it. Perhpas then they can be accountable later if that is accomplished. I think even merely deciding qualifications is a matter of many years away. and like you said yourself the implementation is "up to our ability". We are not there yet. Allahu a3lam |
| Re: Verse in Qu'ran relating to Adultery |
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| muqaddar |
| 08/10/02 at 21:41:58 |
| [slm] Well put my brother ! But I wasn't talking about a situation where a few go applying it on others . i was explicity referring to the situation where the woman wants to repent sincerely and feels that her repentance is only sincere if she accepts the punishment, similarly in Somalia the crminals OPTED for the islamic punishment, as they are doing now in Falesteen. Thus we are talking about people who are prepared to have the Law apply to themselves first |
| Re: Verse in Qu'ran relating to Adultery |
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| humble_muslim |
| 08/10/02 at 23:34:19 |
| AA Muqaddar, You seem very intent on implementing and following Shariah. If this is the case, you should consider your own action as to whether they are according to Shariah. You openly say that you have talked freely to non mahrems. Is this legal in the Shariah ? |
| NS |
| Re: Verse in Qu'ran relating to Adultery |
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| muqaddar |
| 08/11/02 at 08:55:56 |
| [slm] First this has nothing to do with me implementing sharia... ;D I was referring to cases where somebody wanted to be forgiven for a sin, so please don't turn it into an issue of me wanting sharia IMPOSED/IMPLEMENTED on someone :) Secondly the nah-mahrams are all from my workplace and it's not really possible to avoid them..even with that girl... do you have any idea how difficult it is to draft a lease all on your own? why not get some help from friends... Can I ask why you have a problem with sharia? ;) |
| Re: Verse in Qu'ran relating to Adultery |
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| humble_muslim |
| 08/12/02 at 09:55:36 |
| AA Muqaddar, I apologize for my previous post. I think before any of us start to debate about Shariah, we need to throrugly understand the fiqh of Shariah. It's clear that none of us here are scholars. |
| NS |
| Re: Verse in Qu'ran relating to Adultery |
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| Kashif |
| 08/12/02 at 12:08:59 |
| assalaamu alaikum As some are aware, one Qur'anic science is that of nasikh wal-mansukh, i.e. the abrogation of verses. There were three types of abrogation: a) abrogation of the reading of the verse, but not the ruling (i.e. the ayah was removed from the Qur'an, but its ruling remained), b) abrogation of the ruling of a verse but not its words (i.e. the ayah remains a part of the Qur'an but its ruling is removed), and c) abrogation of both wording and ruling (i.e. neither does the ruling apply anymore nor is the verse a part of the Qur'an anymore). The issue of stoning the adulterer is a case of type (a) abrogation. There used to be a verse in the Qur'an at the Prophet sallallahu alaihi wa sallam's time which the people recited which commanded them to stone the adulterer. However, the reading of it was abrogated, but its ruling remained. The proof for such is the authentically narrated statement of Sayyidina Umar: [color=black]"Allah sent Muhammad with the Truth and revealed the Holy Book to him, and among what Allah revealed, was the Verse of the Rajam (the stoning of married person (male & female) who commits illegal sexual intercourse, and we did recite this Verse and understood and memorized it. Allah's Apostle did carry out the punishment of stoning and so did we after him. "I am afraid that after a long time has passed, somebody will say, 'By Allah, we do not find the Verse of the Rajam in Allah's Book,' and thus they will go astray by leaving an obligation which Allah has revealed. And the punishment of the Rajam is to be inflicted to any married person (male & female), who commits illegal sexual intercourse, if the required evidence is available or there is conception or confession." [Bukhari 8:817][/color] Kashif Wa Salaam |
| NS |
| 08/12/02 at 12:16:11 |
| Kashif |
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