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Dragging dress...

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Dragging dress...
Shahida
02/26/03 at 06:12:06
[slm]

There are many people who say that a woman's jilbaab/dress/outer covering etc should be long enough to drag behind her...

Do any of you know the proof for this? And what if you have to walk in a dirty area, what do you do about the part that drags in the dirt?  I have to pray in the clothing I wear to university/work...I am not comfortable with this concept at all! :(

Wasalam
Shahida
p.s just realised this is a bit "fiqhi", but hope someone has researched this before and can direct me elsewhere...
Re: Dragging dress...
Kathy
02/26/03 at 08:45:43
[slm]

The only thing I found is this in Islam Q&A:

[url]http://63.175.194.25/index.php?ln=eng&ds=qa&lv=browse&QR=12503&dgn=3[/url]

In other fatwas on this same site, under conditions of Hijab/dress there was no mention of the outergarment dragging.
Re: Dragging dress...
amatullah
02/27/03 at 22:34:22
I found this:

Question:
My question is referring to an answer which said that the Prophet (saw) allowed women for thir jilbaabs to trail on the floor as so to cover their bodies completely, but if we were to do this would this not collect the dirt and filth that may be present on the ground, therefore if we were to pray would this nullify the prayer?.

Answer:
Praise be to Allaah.

The society of the Sahaabah (may Allaah be pleased with them all) was extremely keen to protect women and cover their ‘awrahs, and a woman is all ‘awrah, as the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said. So when a woman goes out she should cover her entire body, even her feet. Hence they used to make a “tail” i.e., a woman would make her garment long so that it would be like a tail behind her, so that nothing of her body would show.

Shaykh al-Islam Ibn Taymiyah said: This is what they did when they went outside the house. But inside the house they did not wear that.

Majmoo’ al-Fataawa, 22/119

What you have said – may Allaah guide you – about her garment getting dirty, is as nothing in comparison with the idea of protecting women and closing the door to evil and fitnah (temptation) in society.

You should note that the basic principle is that women should stay in their houses, as Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“And stay in your houses”

[al-Ahzaab 33:33]

So women should not go out unless it is necessary.

With regard to what you mention about the clothes getting dirty, and that some impurity (najaasah) may get into them, that is possible. This question was raised at the time of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him). It was narrated that the umm walad [a concubine who had borne a child to her master] of Ibraaheem ibn ‘Abd al-Rahmaan ibn ‘Awf said: I used to drag my ‘tail’ (i.e., let my garment drag along the ground) and I would pass through filthy places and clean places. Umm Salamah entered upon me and I asked her about that, and she said: I heard the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) say: “What comes after it purifies it.” (Narrated by Imam Ahmad, 25949; al-Tirmidhi, 143; Ibn Maajah, 531. Classed as saheeh by al-Albaani. See Saheeh Abi Dawood, 369).

See al-Muntaqi Sharh al-Muwatta’ by al-Baaji, 1/65

And Allaah knows best.



Islam Q&A (www.islam-qa.com)
Re: Dragging dress...
Kathy
02/28/03 at 08:49:06
[quote]“What comes after it purifies it.” [/quote]

I do not understand....will someone clarify the 'what' & the 'it'?
Re: Dragging dress...
muslimah853
02/28/03 at 12:36:52
[slm]

I dunno, it seems that there is more than one way to skin a cat.

One can cover 'awrah without having your garment drag the ground.

If your garment comes down to your feet, your socks/shoes will cover the rest.



Re: Dragging dress...
zomorrud
02/28/03 at 22:10:15
[color=blue]
bismillah...
assalamu alaikum

[code]I used to drag my ‘tail’ (i.e., let my garment drag along the ground) and I would pass through filthy places and clean places. Umm Salamah entered upon me and I asked her about that, and she said: I heard the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) say: “What comes after it purifies it.” [/code]

the 'what' is the clean places on which the dress treads after coming in contact with filthy places....

the 'it' is the dress itself....

by the way, in the phrase "what comes after [/color][color=red]it[/color][color=blue] purifies[/color][color=black] it[/color][color=blue]" has 2 "it" terms which refer to 2 different things, the first [/color][color=red]it[/color][color=blue] refers to the 'filthy area', while the second [/color][color=black]it [/color][color=blue] refers to the 'garment'.

note the sequence of her trip- first she goes through a dirty area, then a clean area ...

so basically, the lady is being told not to worry, and that the clean area takes away the najas that caught on from walking on the dirty area...

i think ...

take care
wassalam
[/color]
02/28/03 at 22:11:51
zomorrud
Re: Dragging dress...
Ameeraana
03/03/03 at 19:19:30
[quote]You should note that the basic principle is that women should stay in their houses, as Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):  

“And stay in your houses”  

[al-Ahzaab 33:33]  
[/quote]

I thought this applied to the wives of the prophet--if you read the verses immediately preceding this you will see.
Re: Dragging dress...
Halima
03/04/03 at 01:17:53
Yes, Allah knows best.

There has been a great controversy here regarding the Jilbaab.  The women wearing drug it (Jilbaab) through all sorts of filth, including wet areas, especially when it rains.  And these women wear sockses too.  They pray in the same Jilbaab which has been dragged through these dirty places because they say that after dragging the Jilbaab through the dirt, they pass dry areas and hence the nijas is cleaned automatically which makes the Jilbaab tahir for salat.

When asked to quote an authentic hadith, surah or aya which relates to this, no one can honestly tell you anything.  

I personally do not believe that the Jilbaab will be tahir after being dragged through a clean area after the dirt because these dry areas are also not clean but are full of nijas too.  And salat requires total cleanliness.  And cleanliness is Godliness.  

May Allah Subhana Watallah guide us accordingly.

[wlm]

Halima
Re: Dragging dress...
a_Silver_Rose
03/05/03 at 18:06:33
[slm]

This would mean if we have cant wear those long dresses past our ankles then we have to wear socks?
I was praying with shalwar kameez at the mosque and this lady told me that you are suppose to cover your feet while praying. I have been worrying about this... She said that all four schools are in agreement of this. So does this mean that when i pray at home, and after i do wudu I have to wear socks? It makes me wonder because in pakistan most woman dont wear socks with the shalwar kameez even for prayer. Are the prayers not valid? ???
I would appreciate your help.
your sister
03/05/03 at 19:16:10
a_Silver_Rose
Re: Dragging dress...
safa
03/05/03 at 18:45:34
[slm]
as far as i know sis, the hanafi school allows the uncovering of the hands, the face and the feet, while the other schools allow the uncovering of the face and feet alone.

Allah knows best.
Re: Dragging dress...
muslimah853
03/05/03 at 19:54:17
[slm]

Actually, yes, as Sister Safa posted, the Hanafi school does allow for the feet to be uncovered.  Shafi'i and Maliki require the feet to be covered.  I think Hanbali does as well, but I am not 100% sure about that.

Re: Dragging dress...
amatullah
03/17/03 at 19:59:41
[wlm]
muslima 853 you might like to read this article. i did like it

Hijab
Shariffa Carlo Al Andalusia

-In the last few years, I have seen Muslims, become so ignorant of our religion, as our beloved Prophet warned us, that many of us are being fooled by those who would have us worship our desires and abandon the correct worship of Allah.

Narrated 'Abdullah bin 'Amr bin Al' As: I heard Allah's Apostle saying, "Allah does not take away the knowledge, by taking it away from (the hearts of) the people, but takes it away by the death of the religious learned men till when none of the (religious learned men) remains, people will take as their leaders ignorant persons who when consulted will give their verdict without knowledge. So they will go astray and will lead the people astray." Sahih Bukhari: Volume 1, Book 3, Number 100.


We tend to indulge ourselves in "sheikh" hunting when we don't like what we hear, until we find the "sheikh" who tells us what we want to hear. It does not matter sometimes who this "sheikh" is or where he/shs learned or even what level his/her understanding has reached. If we heard someone call him sheikh or her sheikha, we follow what they teach. We would never do this with our life matters, yet for our deen, which extends beyond the limited bounds of our life, we find it easy. We are supposed to verify that everything that we learn is supported by the Quraan and the authentic hadiths of our beloved Prophet.


Narrated Abu Huraira: I said: "O Allah's Apostle! Who will be the luckiest person, who will gain your intercession on the Day of Resurrection?" Allah's Apostle said: O Abu Huraira! "I have thought that none will ask me about it before you as I know your longing for the (learning of) Hadiths. The luckiest person who will have my intercession on the Day of Resurrection will be the one who said sincerely from the bottom of his heart "None has the right to be worshipped but Allah."


And 'Umar bin 'Abdul 'Aziz wrote to Abu Bakr bin Hazm, "Look for the knowledge of Hadith and get it written, as I am afraid that religious knowledge will vanish and the religious learned men will pass away (die). Do not accept anything save the Hadiths of the Prophet. Circulate knowledge and teach the ignorant, for knowledge does not vanish except when it is kept secretly (to oneself)." Sahih Bukhari: Volume 1, Book 3, Number 98.


Think about this. In explanation of this hadith, Umar bin Abdul Aziz told us to seek the knowledge of the hadith. Why? Its obvious, because it is here that we can truely understand the verses of Allah and stay away from shirk, by applying them as they were implemented by our beloved Prophet. Any other way is denying the truth of La ilaha il Allah!


The prophet warned us that there would emerge people, teaching from their ignorance. And those people are alive and thriving today. This is especially sad when we know that knowledge of what is truly Islam is so easy for us to find. We do not have to travel hundreds of miles on foot, or by steed to acquire knowledge of one hadith. They are all collected, authenticated and analyzed for us now. May Allah guide us to the true knowledge.


The latest trend to hit the streets as they say, is the invention of new interpretations for the verses on hijab. They have discovered, it seems, something the Prophet, himself, had not discovered. Audhu billah! At first they claim that the word, "hijab" does not appear in the Quraan. Which is not true. Hijab is there, in relation to the mothers of the believers. who are our examples. Also, jilbab and Khymar, two far more specific terms are there, and they are specifically directed towards us, the Muslim women, and in observing these two, we are essentially observing hijab. Since this is so easily disputed, they have to invent a new loophole. They go on to say that the verse for the khymar does not say hair. They have taken a verse and ignored the implementation of this verse as found in the authentic sunnah or the teachings of the scholars.


Those who are teaching this lunacy have committed two great violations. One, they are denying the verses of Allah, which in itself is outright shirk. Second, they are saying that our beloved Prophet did not understand these verses, because when the women began to cover themselves completely, he did not correct them. Which he ALWAYS did when they were wrong!

Narrated Umm Salamah, Ummul Mu'minin: When the verse "That they should cast their outer garments over their persons" was revealed, the women of Ansar came out as if they had crows over their heads. Sunan Abu Dawud: Book 32, Number 4090.

and
Narrated Aisha, Ummul Mu'minin: Safiyyah, daughter of Shaybah, said that Aisha mentioned the women of Ansar, praised them and said good words about them. She then said: When Surat an-Nur came down, they took the curtains, tore them and made head covers (veils) of them. Sunan Abu Dawud: Book 32, Number 4089.


and:
Narrated Anas ibn Malik: The Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) brought Fatimah a slave which he donated to her. Fatimah wore a garment which, when she covered her head, did not reach her feet, and when she covered her feet by it, that garment did not reach her head. When the Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) saw her struggle, he said: There is no harm to you: Here is only your father and slave. Sunan Abu Dawud: Book 32, Number 4094.


Here, the Prophet was waiting for his daughter to cover from her head to her feet, the mother of the believers was praising the women for their understanding and implementation of this verse. If they were wrong, it would have been correction, not praise. Did our great Prophet, himself, not understand? Did his beloved daughter not understand? Did Aisha, the mother of the Believers, who is undisputedly one of the greatest scholars of al Islam, not understand? It is inconceivable that the Prophet and these great woman who lived with and learned from the Prophet himself, would understand Islam less than these Modern self-appointed scholars of Islam. May Allah guide them and protect us from them!


Having said this, let me give you the verses relating to the woman's covering and try to explain them. Allah says:


O Prophet! Tell thy wives and daughters, and the believing women, that they should cast their outer garments (Jalbab) over their persons (when abroad - ie in the public arena): that is most convenient, that they should be known (as such) and not molested. And Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful. 33:59


and
And say to the believing women that they should lower their gaze and guard their modesty; that they should not display their beauty and ornaments except what (must ordinarily) appear thereof; that they should draw their veils (khymar) over their bosoms and not display their beauty except to their husbands, their fathers, their husband's fathers, their sons, their husbands' sons, their brothers or their brothers' sons, or their sisters' sons, or their women, or the slaves whom their right hands possess, or male servants free of physical needs, or small children who have no sense of the shame of sex; and that they should not strike their feet in order to draw attention to their hidden ornaments. And O ye Believers! turn ye all together towards Allah, that ye may attain Bliss. 24:31


and
O ye who believe! Enter not the Prophet's houses,- until leave is given you,- for a meal, (and then) not (so early as) to wait for its preparation: but when ye are invited, enter; and when ye have taken your meal, disperse,without seeking familiar talk. Such (behavior) annoys the Prophet: he is ashamed to dismiss you, but Allah is not ashamed (to tell you) the truth. And when ye ask (his ladies) for anything ye want, ask them from before a screen: that makes for greater purity for your hearts and for theirs. Nor is it right for you that ye should annoy Allah's Messenger, or that ye should marry his widows after him at any time. Truly such a thing is in Allah's sight an enormity. 33:53


In these verses, we see that we have been commands to wear the jalbab and the Khymar. What are these things? For a technical explanation, we find that jalabib, which is used in the verse is the plural of Jalbab. "Jalbab, is actually the outer sheet or coverlet which a woman wraps around on top of her garments to cover herself from head to toe. It hides her body completely." Lisan ul Arab vol 1 p. 273. The best explanation is that it is what we would today call a burqa or an abiya.


In explanation of this word, Allamah ibin Al Hazam writes:
"In the Arabic language of the Prophet, Jalbab is the outer sheet which covers the entire body. A piece of cloth which is too small to cover the entire body could not be called Jalbab." Al Muhalla, vol. 3, p. 217.


The second piece, the Khymar is from the root Khmr which means something which veils. As we can see from the term Khamir (alcohol or any substance which veils the mind). The Khymar was a piece which covers the head and the breast area as instructed in the verse.


Sheikh Al Albaani was asked about this verse in relation to its limitations. He explained that it means a covering that goes over the head, shoulder and breast area, excluding the face. Here is the exchange in a question/answer
format:
"What is the ruling regarding a woman's wearing a scarf on her head?


Ans. That is not enough - she has to wear a 'khimaar' which covers the head and chest. The scarf is not loose fitting and does not cover enough. Should not the shoulders also be covered by it?


Yes, that is the 'khimaar'. It is a wide cover covering the head and shoulders. When we say that it covers the chest, then it covers the shoulders since it is wide. But as regards the head-scarf we often see a woman wearing
it revealing a part of the neck due to it, but the 'khimaar' covers the neck and shoulder, and Allaah ta'aala orders that saying:


WALYADRIBNA BIKHUMURIHINNA 'ALAA JUYOOBIHINNA
The head-scarf is as they say these days a compromise, and there is no such thing in Islaam!


Many people hold that the khimaar' is a covering for the face.


Ans. That is ignorance with regard to the language. The 'khimaar' is a covering for the head and the man also wears the khimaar - putting it upon his head - the same as for the woman. He ta'aala said:


WALYADRIBNA BIKHUMURIHINNA 'ALAA JUYOOBIHINNA


If the khimaar covered the face then He ta'aala would not say WALYADRIBNA meaning pull/draw together, but he would have said "let fall" [ using the verb 'sadala' ]. This is ignorance regarding the language."


Here we can clearly see the limitations of the piece that covers our heads. It must be over the shoulders and the breast to fit what is described in the Quraan.


When we put the two pieces together, what we have is a long dress jilbab and a head/shoulder/breast cover: khymar. These two pieces were commanded by Allah. Together they comprise the cover of the Muslim woman. Now, how do we know how serious it is to not cover? We find this in the explanations of the verses. We have one particularly strong hadith which pretty much covers it all.


The Prophet said, "The worst among women are those who freely leave their homes without hijab. They are hypocrites and few of those will enter paradise." (Sunan Baihaqi)


Also, In al Qurtubi, Aisha is narrated as having said to some women from the tribe of the Bani Tamim who were wearing dresses made of thin material when they were visiting her, "If you are mumin this is not the type of dress
suitable for mumin women. But if you are not mumin, then do as you please." Also, narrated in Al Qurtubi is a statement from the mother of the believers, Aisha, that the woman who does not cover does not believe in surat al Noor. These are very strong words, for the one who disbelieves in any part of the Quraan is not a believer and has committed shirk!


So strong is the importance of covering, that we can not even reveal to others that which is hidden. Abdullah Ibin Masud narrated that the Prophet said, "A woman should not look at or touch another woman so that she may describe this woman to her husband in such a way as if he were actually looking at her." (Bukhari, Abu Dawud)


The covering of the Muslim woman is not an option, it is a privilege and a commandment from Allah. It is the duty of every Muslim woman and the responsibility of every Muslim man. For the man was commanded to:


O ye who believe! save yourselves and your families from a Fire whose fuel is Men and Stones, over which are (appointed) angels stern (and) severe, who flinch not (from executing) the Commands they receive from Allah, but do (precisely) what they are commanded. 66:6


Now, the words of Allah in commanding us to wear khymar and jalbab should be enough. Added to that the words of our Prophet and the explanations from his wives, should be more than enough. Let's add to that that it is the consensus of the scholars (ijimaa) that the "hijab" is mandatory, and there should remain no woman who does not observe it, if she believes in Allah and the last day.


So, knowing this, what is the believing woman to do, except submit to Allah. And how exactly do we do this. The cover of the Muslim woman is two pieces: An overgarment (jilbab) and a head/shoulder/bosom scarf (khymar). It is not pants, skirts, or other... The word in the Quraan is clear -- jalbab (which is clearly a one piece garment). Also, the teachings and examples of the mothers of the believers, the family of the Prophet and the female companions of the Prophet are enough to show us that these are the only acceptable alternatives. While pants and skirts were available and known, there is not one single example of them being utilized as appropriate covering outdoors. This means they can not be utilized as such today. The covering has certain limitations and those limitations came from Allah's commandments, not man (or woman's) desires or rationalizations.


Second, the dress must be loose, and touching (even dragging ) on the ground. We know this from the following two hadiths.


When the Prophet was talking about Allah not gazing upon the one who trails his garments in pride,


Narrated Umm Salamah, Ummul Mu'minin: Safiyyah, daughter of AbuUbayd, said: When the Apostle of Allah (peace_be_upon_him) mentioned lower garment, Umm Salamah, wife of the Apostle of Allah (peace_be_upon_him), asked him: And a woman, Apostle of Allah? He replied: She may hang down a span. Umm Salamah said: Still it (foot) will be uncovered. He said: Then a forearm's length, nor exceeding it. Sunan Abu Dawud: Book 32, Number 4105.


Also,


Narrated Dihyah ibn Khalifah al-Kalbi: The Apostle of Allah (peace_be_upon_him) was brought some pieces of fine Egyptian linen and he gave me one and said: Divide it into two; cut one of the pieces into a shirt and give the other to your wife for veil. Then when he turned away, he said: And order your wife to wear a garment below it and not show her figure. Sunan Abu Dawud: Book 32, Number 4104.


These two hadiths show that the dress must touch the ground and must be loose. Since we know that they had shoes and socks, and they were not given as options, then we also know that they can not be taken as options today. The dress had to cover the feet and the legs. The commandments of covering never spoke of just covering the skin. They gave a specific UNIFORM for the Muslim woman. Remember, in the verse about Jalbab, one of the reasons for it was so that the Muslim woman should be known as such. This is important for us to remember. We need to be able to recognize each other, and to be able to be easily recognized by others. This is one of the primary purposes of the cover.


Also, the dress should not be decorated, making it more beautiful than what is covered. Allah commands the believing woman to "not display their beauty" (24:31). and he orders us to " not strike their feet in order to draw attention to their hidden ornaments" (24:31). We are not to show the decorations we place on ourselves or even to allude to that which we hide. Therefore, the things which do show, the jilbab and the khymar should be devoid of decoration or ornamentation.


Now we have a dress which is plain, long and wide and a plain scarf which covers the head, shoulders and bossom. The only things showing should be the face and the hands. now what is face. It is the part we have to clean in wudu --the circle from the hairline (not including any hair), to the ears but not including the ears as they are considered part of the head, to the chin. The hands are from the wrist down. All else is considered aura (that which is to be hidden) including the feet which we were told to cover with our dress, not with socks or shoes. To strengthen this, we have a hadith from Sunan Abu Dawud. A woman asks Um Salama, " I am a woman who drags herdress and I walk in the dirty places, what shall I do? Um Salama answered, "Rasool Allah said 'What is after it purifies it. '" Therefore, if the dress could be shortened and socks or shoes serve in their place as sufficient covering, this special right, that the dress becomes clean for salat by dragging over clean dirt would not have been necessary or even acceptable. And Allah knows Best.


Last, but not least, because the woman and man are forbidden to imitate each other and because we can not imitate the Kufar, the dress also can not imitate the dress of a man (like pants or a thob or dishdasha) nor can it
imitate the kufar, like trying to make it match the latest kafir fashions or dressing like a nun. And the dress should never be a dress of pride.


May Allah guide us all to the best for this life and the next.


May Allah guide our women to the proper dress of the Muslim woman, to the uniform of the Muslim, to the dress of dignity and piousness.


May Allah keep us from worshipping our desires and guide us all to the sirat al mustaqeem. Ameen.

03/17/03 at 23:05:40
Kathy
Re: Dragging dress...
sista
03/25/03 at 19:15:55
[slm]

Oh [i]jazakallahu kheiran[/i] sis amatullah - liked that article muchly  :)

Mind,

[quote]Narrated Aisha, Ummul Mu'minin: Safiyyah, daughter of Shaybah, said that Aisha mentioned the women of Ansar, praised them and said good words about them. She then said: When Surat an-Nur came down, they took the curtains, tore them and made head covers (veils) of them. Sunan Abu Dawud: Book 32, Number 4089.[/quote]

This very same hadith was quoted to me recently...except that it was translated( "they...tore them and covered their [i]faces[/i] with them"...can anyone clarify the linguistics?

Also,

[quote]The Prophet said, "The worst among women are those who freely leave their homes without hijab. They are hypocrites and few of those will enter paradise." (Sunan Baihaqi)[/quote]

You know, it scares me when I read these things: I am suddenly thrown into doubt as to how to convey it to people.  Hiding knowledge is forbidden, yet....

A Muslimah recently said to me, half in jest (but only half), that I should not give her "disapproving looks" when she says or does something that she and I both know is wrong.  The reason she gives is that "others might take it the wrong way" - meaning that sisters who don't practise as such would be further pushed away...

I don't sermonise at them already...and if I don't like something I can't exactly pretend it's ok, can I? I'm not the kind of person to be issuing fatwas right, left and centre, or consigning people to Hellfire according to my own caprice...but surely "disapproving looks" (or, more accurately, "pained expressions") do not fall into the category of such dogma as these actions represent...?  

How do you go about giving naseeha to sisters such as these, then?

[wlm]
   
Re: Dragging dress...
Kathy
03/25/03 at 22:29:14
[slm]
Who is Sunan Baihaqi?
Re: Dragging dress...
amatullah
03/27/03 at 08:50:10
[quote]Who is Sunan Baihaqi? [/quote]
Albaihaqi is old times scholar
that is his book

[quote] that I should not give her "disapproving looks" when she says or does something that she and I both know is wrong.  The reason she gives is that "others might take it the wrong way" - meaning that sisters who don't practise as such would be further pushed away... [/quote]

I kine of agree with her. I don't see it as something that will bring anyone closer to practicing Islam. Allah swt described the believers as Merciful to each other. But you know I usualy compare that with the hadeeth that we have to enjoin good and forbid evil by hand and then word and weakest of faith is just in your heart to disapprove it.

So i say use your judgement and your battle. I mean it might just be better to joke around and let way for a nice conversation that might lead to invite to a halaqa. Or if it is in the masjid, hand her a scarf. etc.

I mean if they are hyppocritical for not wearing it, we would NOT be believers (according to hadeeth) if we didn't love for others Muslims what we love for ourselves. So I think if I am wrong I would like someone to correct me in the best manner and aside kind of thing probably if not indirectly.
Just thinking outloud.


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