Madinat al-Muslimeen Islamic Message Board

A R C H I V E S

Think before you give to muslim charity?

Madina Archives


Madinat al-Muslimeen Islamic Message Board

Think before you give to muslim charity?
panjul
03/31/03 at 22:26:13
MOOD CAUTIOUS AT MUSLIM FEST
Babita Persaud, St. Petersburg Times, 3/31/03

[url]http://www.sptimes.com/2003/03/31/TampaBay/Mood_cautious_at_Musl.shtml[/url]

TAMPA - The annual Islamic Charity Festival almost didn't happen.

After war broke out in Iraq, organizers discussed postponing the festival, which local Muslims hold to offer food and clothing to mostly non-Muslim needy residents.

Corporations could be counted on in past years to provide soft drinks and clothes.

But this year, "nothing," said festival vice chairman Rasheed "Sam" Hakki, a local Muslim and orthopedic surgeon.

"The corporations are afraid to donate," he said. "Afraid (Attorney General John) Ashcroft will knock on their door and call them terrorist(s) because they give to a Muslim charity."
04/01/03 at 22:31:11
jannah
Re: Think before you give to mulim charity?
bhaloo
03/31/03 at 23:17:13
[slm]

Yes, this is a big concern and should be taken seriously.  What are we supposed to do?  Who should we give to?
Re: Think before you give to mulim charity?
panjul
04/01/03 at 00:37:52
[slm]

yep bhaloo, i don't know what to do. I don't mind giving sadaqah to non-muslim charities. but for some reason...i want to give my zakat to a muslim charity, i just feel it's more appropriate. But of course that's juse my "feeling," and i should be asking someone if it's ok to give zakat to a non-Muslim charity. For the first time in life I will be eligible to give zakat (because of all that gold my parents and my hubby gave me!)  if it weren't for that gold jewlry, i don't think i'd be eligible to give zakat. oh well.....

So do you happen to know the answer to my problem? or anyone? i'm too lazy to call the imam. :) inshallah i'll do it once it's time for me to pay.
i'm thinking of just sending the money to pakistan through a relative, it's easy, i don't have to be afraid of John Ashcroft and there are plenty of poor people there as well.

*sigh* what is the world coming to???
Re: Think before you give to mulim charity?
bhaloo
04/01/03 at 01:16:47
[slm]

Zakat is only for Muslims, it can not be given to Muslims.  As for a non-Muslim charity distributing the funds to Muslims, that I don't know.

Personally I am not comfortable giving sadaqah to non-muslims because of the purposes it could be used for.
04/01/03 at 18:20:27
bhaloo
Re: Think before you give to mulim charity?
Maliha
04/01/03 at 08:29:23
[slm]
What about Islamic Relief? As far as I know they are still up and running and they are in dire need of funds.

www.irw.org

Sis,
Maliha
[wlm]
Re: Think before you give to mulim charity?
Dude
04/01/03 at 09:46:09
[quote]Zakat is only for Muslims, it can not be given to non-Muslims.  As for a non-Muslim charity distributing the funds to Muslims, that I don't know.
[/quote]

Is this stated in the Quoran somewhere? I ask because there are plenty of non-Muslim charities out there that need money too.
Re: Think before you give to mulim charity?
zomorrud
04/01/03 at 10:35:18
[color=darkblue]
bismillah...

you can direct your charities to a canadian relief org.  this is [u]reliable[/u].

[hr]
Canadian Relief Foundation
150 Brant Avenue, Brantford, Ontario.
N3T3H7. CANADA

Tel: (519) 758-0397  
Fax: (519) 720-0282  

contact ms. anne-marie st. onge for questions
[email]am-st-onge@canadianrelief.ca[/email]

[url]http://www.canadianrelief.ca[/url]
[hr]

please consider this.

take care
z.
[/color]
04/01/03 at 10:40:28
zomorrud
Re: Think before you give to mulim charity?
siddiqui
04/01/03 at 11:08:03
[slm]
Br Dude there are two major types of financial charities in Islam

1) Zakat Obligatory when conditional
2) Sadqah in general

Zakat is conditional in sense that one needs to qualify for it ( have a minimum income /savings for qualification just like a tax strata/slab)
It is obligatory once you are in that category to give zakat and  thats again a fixed amount(percentage) given only to certain people (not all).It is derived from the hadeeth and other books of jurisprudence that it should be given to Muslims /non muslims who fall in those categories.


Sadaqah or general charity/good deed  can be given to muslims and non muslims alike, it can be in money or in kind (not like the fixed percentage of zakath) a simple sadqah is being nice and smiling while talking to your fellow human being or even removing an obstruction or harmful thing from the road (dont see too many harmful things on the road here in usa except speeding cars  ;)

Yes all sources of charity are needy all charitable work is good, the point is Non muslim charaties are genreally  better funded than muslim ones (especially small ones) and this if for fact as I have observed back home.

Sr Panjul It takes a liitle extra effort to locate muslim charities , and you dont have to give zakaat through charities but send it over to India?pak?bangla/............... to freinds and family and ask them to give it to recepients
I know this can be done for I have done it my self when I was back for friends and family abroad

As far as sadaqah goes  UNICEF is collecting money specificaly for the childern of IRAQ




http://www.supportunicef.org/forms/whichcountry_iraq.html"

Donations by mail can be sent to the
Following address:  
Children First Internet Donation
UNICEF
3 UN Plaza
New York, NY  10017


[wlm]
04/03/03 at 22:23:45
siddiqui
Re: Dont think before you give to Muslim charity
a_Silver_Rose
04/01/03 at 13:51:02
[slm]

[quote]Yes, this is a big concern and should be taken seriously.  What are we supposed to do?  Who should we give to?[/quote]

Brother Bhaloo why should we be afraid when we are not doing anything wrong? Didnt you say that the soldiers should have courage to resist 'the US barbaric calls for war' If they resist, they go to jail, if we resist we are called terrorists. Same difference. If there can be a christian organization that donates money to Iraq then  there can also be a Muslim organization. When there are Muslims organizations then our priority should be first to give to that organization. I dont think we should be afraid to send donation money to Iraq. Muslims should ONLY fear Allah (swt).

[quote]Zakat is only for Muslims, it can not be given to non-Muslims.  As for a non-Muslim charity distributing the funds to Muslims, that I don't know.[/quote]
Yes I havent ever heard this also. I know that during the time of the sahaba, the nonMuslims did not have to pay zakat (instead they paid tax) but the Muslims and NonMuslims were all living in the same area so I thought the zakat money went to both.





Re: Think before you give to mulim charity?
Dude
04/01/03 at 16:33:01
I've never really understood the difference between Zakat & Sadqah. All I know is that once per year, my wife tells me I have to send money to India (our familly has selected an Indian orphanage). I think this is part of our Zakat, because we also give to a select few local, non-Muslim charities. Now I know why, and the differences, so thanks for that!:)

Anyhow,  I think the fear is out of reason that if you donate to a Muslim charity:

1.      You will be profiled by the FBI as being an enabler to terrorist organizations.
2.      The hard earned money you have donated may be confiscated.

These concerns are legitimate, and I think what he’s getting at is that you shouldn’t be putting yourself at risk, if you personally haven’t done anything wrong, or never intended to do anything wrong. There surely are some Muslim charities out there that have been set up to funnel money to terrorist organizations (sort of like the IRA has collected money for years), under the guise of humanitarian benefit. There are, I’m sure, more that have been set up for genuinely good intentions, where all of the funds go to good causes (i.e.: no guns). The point is, is appears that the US Government has put them all in the same pot, and is treating every one as if it were an arm of a terrorist group.

Is that about right guys? I don’t want to speak for anyone on that topic. Anyhow, Bhaloo and Janna seem really up to speed on this…I just know what I read in the papers and here.

The point is, if you have $$$ to give, and you want it to get to the needy victims of Iraq, there are a couple of very fine charitable organizations that have been posted here, where you give yourself the best chance of the funds actually reaching their intended recipients. Really, the victims are going to need aid, and if you want to help, the best way is to act now by giving money to an established, reliable charity.
Re: Think before you give to mulim charity?
siddiqui
04/01/03 at 17:12:17
[slm]
[quote]There surely are some Muslim charities out there that have been set up to funnel money to terrorist organizations (sort of like the IRA has collected money for years), under the guise of humanitarian benefit[/quote]

Isnt it sad Br Dude that the same govt which cracks down on these ALLEGED organizations provides millions of dollars in Financial and Military aid to the opposite side and help in perpetrating state sponsored terrorisim and genocide  >:(

Isnt it sad that the govt who goes to war for ALLEGED violations of 12 year old UN resolutions but ignore long standing(more than 50 years old) against peope in the same region and go on to support the massacres of civilians

There are always two sides to a story,or as Sheikh Mukhtar said last night you cannot clap with just one hand two hands are needed

Please do not get blinded with false sense of moralities , if one has to apply justice it has to be across the board
[wlm]
04/01/03 at 17:14:03
siddiqui
Re: Think before you give to mulim charity?
bhaloo
04/01/03 at 18:26:57
[slm]

OOOPS, i did a typo, duh.  Zakat (is a tax) is only for Muslims, sadaqah (charity) can be given to muslims or non-muslims.

The problem with giving to Muslim charities right now is that Rumsfield said that if he finds out a charity is supporting "terrorist activities" (God knows how these people define it, they call Muslims that defend themselves terrorists), Rumsfield said he will strip the citizenship of people that donate to these charities and kick them out of the country.  That's pretty scary.  We have to consider the harm vs the good in doing something.  If it gets me deported by giving to certain charities, that's not very good, but if I can achieve it by giving to a non-Muslim charity that does the same thing then I'm better off doing that.  But if I can't fulfill my religious obligations, then that is a serious problem, and one would have to consider migrating to fulfill his/her religious obligations, but alhumdullilah we aren't at this stage YET.
Re: Think before you give to mulim charity?
Dude
04/01/03 at 18:38:18
Believe me...I'm as saddened and sickened by all this as anyone. Yes, the whole situation is dripping with bloody irony.

On the charity front thing, just pointing it out. Charities have long been abused by too many groups. Some use a charity front to fund illegal activities (the IRA / terrorist examples), some simply use it as a means of their own profit...this is why it is so important to find out how much of the actual dollar goes towards the not-for profit cause. They prey on the good intentions of honest people- like many on this board, I'm sure. I KNOW I've been a sucker once or twice.

It is sooooooooo easy to set up a non-profit society in Canada- and to get a tax-deductible charity number- it is sickening. Really...it is incredibly easy to set one up, and it can be used for anything...tax evasion, money laundering...you name it. The feds don’t even have a watchdog up here. There is probably more money being funneled to terrorist groups through Canada than the States right now. Of course that’s a wild guess…but it wouldn’t surprise me.

Sad that this happens, and it overshadows all the legitimate, honest charities out there.
Re: Think before you give to mulim charity?
siddiqui
04/01/03 at 18:49:34
[slm]
[quote]The feds don’t even have a watchdog up here[/quote]

The same as there are no citizens groups that watch what the govt is doing with their tax dollars >:(

[quote]There is probably more money being funneled to terrorist groups through Canada than the States right now.[/quote]

Thats something I cannot comment about , but I can tell you the local tax money here is the biggest source of state sponsored terrorisim in some countries

In the  end its wise to know where your money is going to (tax or charity)
In fact its your right and you need to have a say
[wlm]
Re: Think before you give to muslim charity?
Kathy
04/02/03 at 09:03:11
[slm]

You can give your Zakat to Dawah Centers.

The Islamic Awareness Center, that I volunteer at, has no links at all to any country, nor any associations to any political group.  All monies are used for Dawah purposes....
[i]( IM, or e-mail me for the address to send a tax exempt donation to this non for profit organization!)[/i]

"You should believe in Allah and His Messenger,
and strive in Allah's way with your wealth and your persons; that will be better for you if you only know. "Qur'an 61:11
04/02/03 at 09:06:15
Kathy
Re: Think before you give to muslim charity?
Muneerah134
04/02/03 at 16:47:06
[slm]
Here are some things the sisters in my women's group are going to try to do, inshaAllah:
1. Make care packages for those who are in the US service that are Muslim, specifically my best friend Zarifah's two oldest sons, Ali and Dawood who are in the Marines. But generally for any folks "the boys" feel they want to share with. They have asked for:
Books and magazines (we told them to feel free to pass them on to their fellow soldiers when they finish), hard candy, dental floss, CDs, lip balm, tube socks, travel games, granola bars, disposable cameras, instant oatmeal, and letters - they asked all their "mothers" to write letters, letters, and letters and include mail from all the children in our group. They both said they would love mail from the Muslims. :-*

2. Identify local Muslims trying to help and add our contributions to the "pot"

3. I mentioned the UNICEF fund to the group and we are going to try to collect for that too.

4. Pray, fast and then pray and fast some more. Extra du'a for everyone in harms way, in Iraq, the countries in Africa, Afghanistan, everywhere.

I was threatened once before like this during the time we were marching for civil rights in this country.  Jail, death, etc. I made out okay then, alhamdullilah, in spite of traveling with some pretty radical folks. InshaAllah, we will all make out okay now. Zakat (and sadaqa) purifies your wealth and is a duty on all of us.  

"You should believe in Allah and His Messenger, and strive in Allah's way with your wealth and your persons; that will be better for you if you only know. "Qur'an 61:11

'Nuff said...
:-) Muneerah []
Re: Think before you give to muslim charity?
BroHanif
04/02/03 at 17:27:19
Salaams,

[quote]Make care packages for those who are in the US service that are Muslim, specifically my best friend Zarifah's two oldest sons, Ali and Dawood who are in the Marines. But generally for any folks "the boys" feel they want to share with. They have asked for:
Books and magazines (we told them to feel free to pass them on to their fellow soldiers when they finish), hard candy, dental floss, CDs, lip balm, tube socks, travel games, granola bars, disposable cameras, instant oatmeal, and letters - they asked all their "mothers" to write letters, letters, and letters and include mail from all the children in our [/quote]

You must be kidding yourself? Muslim Marines and they want  care packages. Wow what next lives of Iraqis, all nicely shaped up in red tissue paper. Who are these women, are they patriots or what ? I hope they are not Muslims, to even think of giving something as care packages to such an outfit is an outrage.
Your better off spending your money elsewhere and praying for hidayat and common sense for the Muslim Marines.

When will the Muslims wake up. Please tell me that I read the post wrong.
Salaams

Hanif
Re: Think before you give to muslim charity?
bhaloo
04/02/03 at 20:59:53
[slm]

I agree with Bro. Hanif.  That has got to be the most ridiculous thing I have heard.  Muslims going to kill Muslims.

Why not include this verse from the Quran in the care package:

"Whoso slayeth a believer of set purpose, his reward is Hell for ever. Allah is wroth against him and He hath cursed him and prepared for him an awful doom"(An-Nisa': 93);

;===============================================

May Allah (SWT) destroy those that go and attack the Muslims and grant the Muslims victory.  AMEEN.
[/bRe: Think before you give to muslim charity?
Muneerah134
04/03/03 at 10:44:25
[slm]
I did say that this is what we are going to do. Not that sending boxes to Muslim service people was what everyone should do. And yes we are all Muslims, alhamdullilah. Practicing, praying, fasting, zakat paying, card carrying Muslims.

I also said that we were going to donate money to UNICEF and already have sent money to local relief organizations for both African and Iraqi humanitarian support.

I guess I should've said that they are not in combat positions because they are Muslims.  Both are about to get out, and are trying to do so.  So a few more things to hopefully clarify things and I will return to my former lurking self.

MashaAllah, I agree with everything you both said, it is ridiculous, the whole thing is ridiculous.

But also we are here marching, writing the govenment, emailing our so-called representatives, and everything else we can thing of. Obviously stopping this invasion is not an option, too late for that. Stopping this kind of invasion in the future is also probably not an option. Our government, like most others do exactly what they want, what they feel is in their best interest.

So you do everything you can, you are outraged at the murders and you rail against the injustice. And you pray.

I have been on this planet a long time alhamdullilah.  I have seen many changes and many outrages that have faded from memory over time. Those that were effected directly, myself included, have not forgotten and will not forget. My memory is very good alhamdullilah. So I am aware of what works, and what does not.

Both of these men were raised Muslim, they are hafiz, so they don't need me to send them any verses from Qur'an. That's why they are leaving the service. As they are African American, they know firsthand the prejudice, mistrust, hostility that is what this society is built upon especially the armed forces.  Add to that disgust at being where they are now doing what they are doing.  They know staying in the service is wrong for both of them. That is what is in their messages to us here at home (a bit censured of course, but it's there anyway.) I am not asking anyone to feel sorry for them, I am just trying to be a bit clearer.

Maybe I still have faith in Allah that things will work out in the end. Maybe I know that in spite or because of my govenment's misteps, the world will be what the world is going to be. It is all the decree and I do the best I can to make it better, not to make it worse. I certainly don't criticize anyone for doing the best they feel they can do.

I must say respectfully though - a little harsh brother Bhaloo and Brother Hanif -  maybe I wasn't clear enough in my post.

That is why I usually just read when I am here and don't post too much. I am going to return to my previous policy.

Muneerah (aka Pollyanna the lurker)
Re: Think before you give to muslim charity?
lightningatnite
04/03/03 at 11:14:49
[slm]

Just to clarify things that you asked about Dude:

1.)  Is your wife Muslim???

2.)  Zakat has specific categories of people who are eligible for it.  One of those categories are non-Muslims, provided they are not hostile towards Islam and are friendly to Muslims.  However, in today's world, when Islam is in a fight for its survival and some Muslims are the poorest people on the planet, we have to prioritize.  The Muslim schools in this country, for example are the most underfunded organizations you can imagine.  In our school here in New York, teachers salaries are around the 15K mark and they end up buying their own supplies and photocopies since the school has no money.

3.)  Islamic charities have not been called terrorist because they were funnelling money to Osama bin Laden, etc.  He has enough money.  There are some major relief organizations in this country that were shut down because they provided relief for the widows and children of Palestinians who died in combat (ie. were involved in terrorist activities).

Coincidentally, Clinton was under intense pressure by certain special interest groups to stop the funding that was going to the Palestinians via thase charities, but resisted.  The shutdown of Muslim charities is an opportunistic attempt to remove the moral support that Muslims receive in seeking self determination.

In more general terms, the War on Terrorism could be translated into The War for Globalization.  As some Muslim said on BBC when asked if America would be at war with most of the Muslim world if they weren't Muslim: "No, I don't think so.  Muslims are the only people left on the planet who are willing to stand up for what they believe in, and for what is theirs."

In terms of the future Islam may indeed become increasingly oppressed.  We should prepare for that by funding and supporting our local institutions, which will also minimize the risk of being labeled a terrorist.  A scholar gave an opinion that in the US it is permissable to use our zakat funds to support mosques, schools, and other institutions that preserve and propagate the deen.  Message me if you'd like more info in this opinion.

04/03/03 at 11:16:58
lightningatnite
Re: Think before you give to muslim charity?
lightningatnite
04/03/03 at 11:44:40
[slm] sis. Muneerah,

Jazakallahu khairan for your post, it was very nice :)  Please don't feel bad about posting, I think you represent and very important part of the Ummah that many of us are unfamiliar with.  I think the responses you got were misdirected frustration at the global situation.

For many African Americans, the armed services represents the only means to uplift themselves out of the social conditions they find themselves in.  And more likely than not, these brothers signed up before this whole War on Terrorism thing began.  

Disobedience is not tolerated in the military.  So its not easy to get out...you can't choose which wars you want to fight in.  In fact, it is very plausible that we can one day be drafted into war...thats why we have to register for Selected Services before we can go to college etc.  

Re: Think before you give to muslim charity?
a_Silver_Rose
04/03/03 at 13:54:54
[slm]
[quote]Anyhow,  I think the fear is out of reason that if you donate to a Muslim charity:
1. You will be profiled by the FBI as being an enabler to terrorist organizations.
2. The hard earned money you have donated may be confiscated. [/quote]

yes I understand. I was telling my dad about some latest news, and my dad was freaked out saying not to go to the sites because they monitor you. I assured him im going to a safe site ;) Then the FBI comes and they question you for days, and once your on their list they dont ever leave you alone. Anyhow I am still giving to a Muslim organization because we give donations through our mosque which has permision from the FBI, so maybe other organizations/mosques can do that, inshAllah.

[quote]Maybe I still have faith in Allah that things will work out in the end. Maybe I know that in spite or because of my govenment's misteps, the world will be what the world is going to be. It is all the decree and I do the best I can to make it better, not to make it worse. I certainly don't criticize anyone for doing the best they feel they can do. [/quote]

Exactly, dont worry sis, your post was excellent. very well said, Alhumdulilah.

[quote]I must say respectfully though - a little harsh brother Bhaloo and Brother Hanif -  maybe I wasn't clear enough in my post.  [/quote]
yes it was harsh, astagfirullah...no maybe they were too quick to judge. (and again we are all very upset, and like bro Light said, maybe they took the frustration at the 'global situation')...
[quote]That is why I usually just read when I am here and don't post too much. I am going to return to my previous policy. [/quote] yah same here... Dont let anyone stop you from posting what you think is right though.

[quote]Disobedience is not tolerated in the military.  So its not easy to get out...you can't choose which wars you want to fight in.  In fact, it is very plausible that we can one day be drafted into war...thats why we have to register for Selected Services before we can go to college etc.[/quote]
good point, like i said easier said than done.
04/03/03 at 21:17:50
a_Silver_Rose
Re: Think before you give to muslim charity?
BroHanif
04/03/03 at 16:57:05
Salaams,

[quote]yes it was harsh, astagfirullah...no maybe they were too quick to judge[/quote]

Maybe we were harsh, but why is it that we are in the situation. The fault does not lie at the Jews and the Christians but at us. If we can not get out finger out and help our brothers and sisters whether they be US Marines or whatever Govt service then the fault is with us.
We should have a society that cares for all people and helps them in avoiding going into such a service.

Its also our duty to remind others about the nature of enlisting in such a service, true they may be non combatants but they over there in the 'Theatre of War' where everyone is like a cog supporting each other.

Salaams

Hanif
Re: Think before you give to muslim charity?
se7en
04/03/03 at 17:28:10
as salaamu alaykum,

[quote]Zakat is only for Muslims, it can not be given to non-Muslims.[/quote]

In the Qur'an (9:60) it mentions eight categories of people eligible for zakah, one of which is non-Muslims in specific circumstances.

For more on this, check out the article [url=http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Parthenon/7377/z11.htm]here[/url].

I think Lightningatnite makes an excellent point tho:

[quote]Zakat has specific categories of people who are eligible for it.  One of those categories are non-Muslims, provided they are not hostile towards Islam and are friendly to Muslims.  However, in today's world, when Islam is in a fight for its survival and some Muslims are the poorest people on the planet, we have to prioritize.  The Muslim schools in this country, for example are the most underfunded organizations you can imagine.  In our school here in New York, teachers salaries are around the 15K mark and they end up buying their own supplies and photocopies since the school has no money. [/quote]

w'Allahu a'lam.

wasalaamu alaykum :-)
04/03/03 at 17:28:47
se7en
Re: Think before you give to muslim charity?
Dude
04/04/03 at 10:41:03
[quote]Just to clarify things that you asked about Dude:

1.)  Is your wife Muslim
[/quote]

Is that out of curiosity, or is there a point behind it?

No offence intended, but I'm getting a bit tired of having to explain & justify myself around here. If you like, you can read about my introduction to Islam here: http://www.jannah.org/cgi-bin/madina/YaBB.pl?board=madrasa;action=display;num=1048535034;start=0 . Not great reading by any means, but it probably does the best job of explaining where I'm at. You all must think I'm some sort of confused and lost soul, but that couldn't be further from the truth.

Just because one questions religious practices doesn't make that person a non-beleiver in the all-mighty.

Anyhow, thanks for clearing up the Zakah tax for me. I've never had a problem with the Muslim charity my wife chose. I do have problems with those in the community who insist (incorrectly, as I've learned here) that I'm obligated to give my money to Muslim only charities. I've selected charities like the Special Olympics, Canuck Place, the Orphan's Fund, and other non-Muslim organizations. Those are local, and we've given to other international charities as well. Unicef is a good one.

My point being, there are plenty of good, non-threatening, non-Muslim (and non-religious) charities that need money just as badly...I guess I'm getting sick of getting grief from Muslims in our community on where I send my money.

I agree that right now, we should all perhaps re-evaluate where we give, simply because there is a greater demand for humanitarian effort than usual, and organizations like Unicef are in a position to help.
04/04/03 at 14:03:40
Dude


Madinat al-Muslimeen Islamic Message Board
A R C H I V E S

Individual posts do not necessarily reflect the views of Jannah.org, Islam, or all Muslims. All trademarks and copyrights on this page are owned by their respective owners. Comments are owned by the poster and may not be used without consent of the author.
The rest © Jannah.Org