A R C H I V E S
Madinat al-Muslimeen Islamic Message Board
| Visiting other places of worship? Good or Bad? |
|---|
| Rameeza |
| 05/29/03 at 22:29:40 |
| I've attended Mass with a friend at a Catholic church twice. Once I was visiting a friend and her entire family was going for Midnight Mass on Xmas Eve. The second time was with a friend recently. I was going to a concert by a Tenor I wanted to see. The concert started just after the Mass. I was wondering whether it was wrong. I did not feel like it was. It actually strengthened my belief. For example, the second time I attended the bible recital before the sermon was on the peace that has Jesus saying that a spirit will come who will speak what God wants etc etc. I know that this is Jesus' reference to the Prophet PBUH. I don't know the exact book or verse number but I recognise it when I hear it. I was listening to it and wondering if the Priest ever thought 'who' the verse referred to. The verse makes it pretty clear that it would not be the holy ghost. I will try to find out the exact wording and come back. Getting back to my original question... is it not recommended that we visit these places? or is it discouraged? ??? By the way, I've visited many churches since I have an interest in old architecture, but no Mass was being conducted. ANd I've also visited Hindu temples during their prayer out of curiosity and Buddhist temples. As you can see I am either nosy or interested in art and architecture, which leads me to all these places. :) Well, what do you think? |
| Re: Visiting other places of worship? Good or Bad? |
|---|
| Nabila |
| 05/30/03 at 04:17:57 |
| [slm] I dont think its prohibited to us to visit other places of worship, I know for a fact that Umar (raa) visited a church, but refused to pray in it because he was afraid that Muslims might then want to turn it into a masjid. I know that Sheikh Yusuf Qaradawi has visited the Pope in Rome too. I know what you mean about the architechture -- theres a Greek Orthodox church nearby, and inside its pretty cool :) ma asalaamah and take care |
| Re: Visiting other places of worship? Good or Bad? |
|---|
| WhatDFish |
| 05/30/03 at 05:49:52 |
| It is wrong to attend a worship session in a church or a temple. Your presence in itself is an acknowledgement that their 'deity' has a right of worship, their 'deen' is the truth and so is their worship. So a Muslim must stay away from falsehood. “And whoever seeks a religion other than Islam, it will never be accepted of him” [Aal ‘Imraan 3:85] “And it has already been revealed to you in the Book (this Qur’ân) that when you hear the Verses of Allâh being denied and mocked at, then sit not with them, until they engage in a talk other than that” [al-Nisa’ 4:140] Also, if your eeman is weak, they would try to entice you with their specious arguments or shaytan would try his utmost best to plant doubts in your mind. Do you want to risk losing your eeman? na`udhubiLlah. sidenote - the muslims of today are no `Umar. |
| Re: Visiting other places of worship? Good or Bad? |
|---|
| Kathy |
| 05/30/03 at 09:10:06 |
| [slm] I am a revert. Due to an extensive family, neighbors and belonging to an Interfaith group I have been to churches, syagouges, temples etc... For me personally, and my son, whom I drag to these events, going has had a very positive effect on us. As you leave, you just can't help but shake your head, knowing they are so wrong and we are so right. or me it absolutely supports my decision made almost 20 years ago. As my son and I approached the last church we toured, he asked me if he could destroy all the idols once we got inside. Ok... I smirked... and so did the Imam's wife.... However, as I explained why he shouldn't, I was pleased that his young mind was already processing the correct thoughts and knew what he was going to encounter inside and how wrong it was. He just needs a little fine tuning... As a post script... on the last trip, the priest spoke about Icons and how the are 'created and worshipped' It was a wonderfully deep insight that i had not know before. Of course later, Ali and I had a field day with that conversation! |
| Re: Visiting other places of worship? Good or Bad? |
|---|
| Rameeza |
| 05/30/03 at 10:17:27 |
| [slm] Thats interesting Kathy because everytime I go to one of these things I feel even more convinced about Islam. For example, every place of worship I've been to has had some item or some statue that they have used during a prayer etc. The priest holds up the cross or something else in these places and people worship it etc. Hindu temples have the statues and flowers etc etc but our prayers just involve us being directly in front of God and this is pretty cool. No person or object comes inbetween. Umar [radiyallahu anhu] is my favourite Sahaba, since he has many qualities that I hold to be the most important. I like the just and straight forward nature portrayed by the Hadith on UMAR [radiyallahu anhu]. Yet I feel that there are many excellent muslims these days too. I would not want to belittle them by saying that no one is an Umar today. There might be those who are better, since Allah is the only judge. Plus, temptations today are so great and many still fight these temptations 1400 odd years after the prophet pbuh. “And it has already been revealed to you in the Book (this Qur’ân) that when you hear the Verses of Allâh being denied and mocked at, then sit not with them, until they engage in a talk other than that” [al-Nisa’ 4:140] Could this mean that, if they ridicule the Quran, you should not sit with them? Yet, I agree that if your Imaan is weak it is not a good idea. Plus, you don't want to condone their worship either. |
| Re: Visiting other places of worship? Good or Bad? |
|---|
| Nabila |
| 05/30/03 at 11:31:55 |
| [slm] I think that in Islam, a thing is only haraam if there is categorical evidence to say it is haraam. To the best of my knowledge nothing in the Quran or hadith prohibit the Muslim from visiting other places of worship. Just to be a bit pernickity with bro Uthmaan :) “And whoever seeks a religion other than Islam, it will never be accepted of him” [Aal ‘Imraan 3:85] I dont think that being in someone else place of worship is seeking another religion. I would think that it ratehr strngthens your own imaan than diminishing it. “And it has already been revealed to you in the Book (this Qur’ân) that when you hear the Verses of Allâh being denied and mocked at, then sit not with them, until they engage in a talk other than that” [al-Nisa’ 4:140] Very rarely does a sermon consist of mockery of anyone elses beliefs. Infact, I hear more 'hate preaching' from Khutbas Muslims than from Sunday sermons. Also, if your eeman is weak, they would try to entice you with their specious arguments or shaytan would try his utmost best to plant doubts in your mind. Do you want to risk losing your eeman? na`udhubiLlah. I would argue that it is at this point that it becomes prohibited for you to enter another place of worship, as it would lead you to do that which is haraam. Alot of things in Islam are about ''self-regulation'' where you make the free choice to do one thing or another. sidenote - the muslims of today are no `Umar. This may be true, but Islaam was sent down as a way of life for all mankind for all time. Such an attitude could lead to the rejection of other halaal things, or make other haraam things halaal, as it could be used as an excuse. I can take being proven wrong :-* ma asalaamah and take care |
| Re: Visiting other places of worship? Good or Bad? |
|---|
| Nomi |
| 05/30/03 at 16:31:48 |
| [slm] all Have you ppl ever thought one these lines What would the people at those places think of you ? i mean dont you think that they'll take it as if you are interested in their religion ?! wouldn't it be anti-dawah !? Just a thought Asim Zafar |
| Re: Visiting other places of worship? Good or Bad? |
|---|
| Nabila |
| 05/30/03 at 16:45:36 |
| [slm] Or conversely -- it would be the best da'wa, it shows you are a normal person who appreciates that they respect their religion just as much as they respect yours. I am interested in their religion, doesnt mean I'm gonna convert! :-* ma asalaamah and take care |
| Re: Visiting other places of worship? Good or Bad? |
|---|
| pearl |
| 05/30/03 at 17:19:44 |
| [quote author=Nomi link=board=madrasa;num=1054258180;start=0#6 date=05/30/03 at 16:31:48]Have you ppl ever thought one these lines What would the people at those places think of you ? i mean dont you think that they'll take it as if you are interested in their religion ?! wouldn't it be anti-dawah !? [/quote] [slm] The people in the church or temple could observe the compassionate, contented and dignified demeanor of the Muslims visiting their house of worship. And that might lead them to wonder "What is this Islam? Maybe I should investigate ..." Pearl |
| 05/30/03 at 17:21:14 |
| pearl |
| Re: Visiting other places of worship? Good or Bad? |
|---|
| faisalsb |
| 06/01/03 at 01:06:23 |
| [slm] Well I think what Sister lady_murasaki_sa said in her first post makes a point since it's fact that Hazrat Umar (RAU) did visit a church when he went to Jerusalam to take the charge of the city. So I think as long as it's just architecture and curiosity about other religions there is no harm. But attending worship sessions of non muslims which have actions of shirk either obvious or hidden, I think that's something we need to be carefull about. As we are not allowed to pray while sun is rising and while sun is setting because that's the time when sun worshippers worship to sun. So when we are not allowed to worship Allah Subhan Wa Tallah just to avoid any doubt or resemblance to non muslims then how it can be allowed to pray along with non muslims and mushriks in their workship sessions? |
| 06/01/03 at 01:08:13 |
| faisalsb |
| Re: Visiting other places of worship? Good or Bad? |
|---|
| Rameeza |
| 06/01/03 at 14:30:36 |
| [slm] "As we are not allowed to pray while sun is rising and while sun is setting because that's the time when sun worshippers worship to sun. So when we are not allowed to worship Allah Subhan Wa Tallah just to avoid any doubt or resemblance to non muslims then how it can be allowed to pray along with non muslims and mushriks in their workship sessions? " I would like to mension that I don't "pray along" with them. I sit and watch and don't even stand or kneel with them. |
| Re: Visiting other places of worship? Good or Bad? |
|---|
| Emerald |
| 06/01/03 at 22:44:48 |
| I can see where you're coming from Sis Rameeza. A while back I had this picking curiousity about what going to Church on Sundays was like and how the Priests sermons were. And even if it was possible to pray in a Church. ( I still do) I asked someone about the praying in a church question, although he is not a scholar, and he said that if there are no idols in the church and it's clean, a Muslim could pray it. To me that made sense because the Earth belongs to Allah (swt) and whatever land/area you pray on, it's His. The idea though that a Muslim is praying in a church could give others the wrong idea which could go against our dawah and is therefore best avoided. About going there, if it makes your eman grow stronger while at the same time allows non-Muslims to see how accepting we are of other faiths then I don't see how it could be wrong. Emerald |
| Re: Visiting other places of worship? Good or Bad? |
|---|
| Nomi |
| 06/01/03 at 23:32:10 |
| [slm] Don't you guys think that there are matters that better be discussed with full-time scholars? i think this one needs to be confirmed from one, i'll try doing that soon inshAllah... btw i recall that i read/heard it somewhere that one of the Sahabah was once reading the bible but the Prophet [saw] disliked Him [ra] doing that. i'll try getting back at it inshAllah Asim Zafar |
| Re: Visiting other places of worship? Good or Bad? |
|---|
| Anonymous |
| 06/02/03 at 00:16:18 |
| [quote]Don't you guys think that there are matters that better be discussed with full-time scholars? i think this one needs to be confirmed from one, i'll try doing that soon inshAllah...[/quote] [quote]i'll try getting back at it inshAllah[/quote] looking forward 2 it Bro JazakAllah |
| Re: Visiting other places of worship? Good or Bad? |
|---|
| Nomi |
| 06/03/03 at 15:04:59 |
| [slm] all Got the answer from a well known scholar, he says its not permissible for Muslims to visit other places of worship, he gave me the reference of a couple of hadiths along with this explanation that nearly all the Sahabah were interfaith but neither were they allowed nor did they use to visit other places of worship. The hadith he mentioned was as follows, interpretation of the meaning "All other places of worship are deluding for Muslims" the other hadith was even more strict but i'll take the word of that scholar for it coz we seldom challenge what a PhD teacher of ours teach us at school/college/uni because s/he's got way more experience/ knowledge etc so for me, "thats that" [slm] Asim Zafar PS: [i]We can not benefit islaam by going against any teaching of it, infact i tried something some time back and i doubted that what i'm doing is right but it "did" affect the other person positively and brought that person closer to islaam, but then i consulted a scholar for the whole thing and realized that what i did was wrong even though it was beneficial for the other person ! so i repented and am trying my best to refrain from it [/i] |
| 06/03/03 at 16:14:46 |
| Nomi |
| Re: Visiting other places of worship? Good or Bad? |
|---|
| Rameeza |
| 06/04/03 at 14:02:41 |
| [slm] Could you post the references so I can look it up. Jazaka Allah |
| Re: Visiting other places of worship? Good or Bad? |
|---|
| Nomi |
| 06/04/03 at 17:13:24 |
[slm]... inshAllah i'll.. but tomorrow is a busy day so i'll be needing some time... bear with me people... jazakumullah A brother in islaam |
| Re: Visiting other places of worship? Good or Bad? |
|---|
| a_Silver_Rose |
| 06/04/03 at 23:52:26 |
| [slm] Well once a yr (on a sunday) in our masjid we have an interfaith youth tour for highschool students. From the masjid we go to a church, and from there another church, then we we will go to jewish temple, then maybe the hindu temple, and then the buhddist temple, and then everyone will come to the masjid. (this is in random order, it changes every year) One place will have snacks. In each place there is about a thirty minute sermon. Many of the muslims like Rameeza said, say that this tour just convinces them more about Islam. This is also a way for dawah as the nonmuslims are equally impressed with Islam and how they have to be clean and take their shoes off in the masjid. And when it is time to come visit the masjid the nonmuslim girls will bring an extra scarf and wear it for respect. This has been going on for many years and still continues. About two years back a couple of men who are considered knowledgable had a problem with this tour, because of this we voted on it. The majority voted to continue this tour and so it does... It was hard to understand what was wrong with this as many nonmuslims as well as Muslims were learning from it, but after reading what Brother Nomi wrote, I think that may be the reason why these few Brothers opposed. Allah (swt) knows best... |
| Re: Visiting other places of worship? Good or Bad? |
|---|
| Nomi |
| 06/05/03 at 14:35:30 |
| [slm] on second thought, i think it would be better if you ask this from your local imam as they are the people to guide us in such affairs [slm] Asim Zafar |
Madinat al-Muslimeen Islamic Message Board |