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Alcohol and Arabic
Sparrow
08/05/03 at 21:06:11
Hey All:

Couple of random questions.  I was having dinner with a friend - also non-Muslim - who has lived in the Middle East for many years and has numerous Muslim friends.  Like me he has an interest in Islam and so we were discussing it.  He said two things that I had never heard or read before and I would like people to comment and/or opine :)

1) he said that there are different versions of the Quran, specifically that the Egyptian version is different from others.  There wasn't time to ask him what he meant and I have been pondering this ever since.   I have been told that all Arabic Qurans say exactly the same thing.  Has anyone ever heard of this?

2) he said he has been told by many of his friends that the Quran does not say that one can not drink alcohol, just that excess should be avoided (don't get drunk, I guess)  Now the Muslims he was refering to were not Westernized partying guys with girlfriends etc.  They are family men who consider themselves "devout," they just truly believe that it is okay under Islam to have a beer or a glass of wine with dinner.  Any comments?

Thanks guys!!  I hope everyone is doing well.

Peace, Sparrow
Re: Alcohol and Arabic
Kathy
08/05/03 at 22:50:22
[wlm]

From Islam Q&A :

[code]No doubt alcohol is intoxicating, and contains this substance that makes people lose their minds. It says in the hadeeth, “Every intoxicant is khamr, and every khamr is haraam (forbidden).” If this is the case, then alcohol is considered to be forbidden and to come under the heading of “khamr”(wine, etc.) which people drink for relaxation or enjoyment. Allaah has forbidden it and stated that it is a sin, as He says interpretation of the meaning):

“They ask you (O Muhammad) concerning alcoholic drink and gambling. Say: ‘In them is a great sin, and (some) benefits for men, but the sin of them is greater than their benefit’”  [al-Baqarah 2:219]

If sin is present and it is great, then it is forbidden. Undoubtedly this alcohol is harmful to the mind and body, and Allaah has forbidden everything that harms the body and mind, and saps the strength. Everything that is harmful to a person is not permitted, because Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning): “And do not kill yourselves” [al-Nisaa’ 4:29]

“and do not throw yourselves into destruction” [al-Baqarah 2:195]

And because this is an extravagant waste of money, an action of the spendthrift which comes under the words of Allaah (interpretation of the meaning): “Verily, the spendthrifts are brothers of the Shayaateen (devils)
[al-Israa 17:27]

Using alcohol in ways other than drinking it may be permitted if small amounts are used, such as mixing it with perfumes that are used on clothes or the body, because it keeps them from spoiling, and because it keeps the clothes clean. This is OK, but drinking it is not permissible under any circumstances.

Shaykh ‘Abd-Allaah ibn Jibreen (www.islam-qa.com)
[/code]
Re: Alcohol and Arabic
faisalsb
08/06/03 at 01:23:44
[slm]

Sister Sparrow I think Sister Kathy has answered your second question very well where ever your following question is concerned:

[quote]he said that there are different versions of the Quran, specifically that the Egyptian version is different from others.  There wasn't time to ask him what he meant and I have been pondering this ever since.   I have been told that all Arabic Qurans say exactly the same thing.  Has anyone ever heard of this?
[/quote]

There are no versions of Quran and all the copies of Quran regardless they are published in America, Europe, Asia or Africa all of them are same. Yes there are different pronunciations in which Quran can be read but it doesn't change the meaning e.g. you read schedule as "shadool" or "seckagual" it has the same meaning but pronunciation is quite different. That way Quran can be read in 7 pronunciations but non of them change it's meaning ................ Allah knows the best
Re: Alcohol and Arabic
Dawn
08/06/03 at 06:12:33
[slm]
[quote author=Sparrow link=board=lighthouse;num=1060128371;start=0#0 date=08/05/03 at 21:06:11]1) he said that there are different versions of the Quran, specifically that the Egyptian version is different from others.  There wasn't time to ask him what he meant and I have been pondering this ever since.   I have been told that all Arabic Qurans say exactly the same thing.  Has anyone ever heard of this?
[/quote]

Sparrow, regarding the above question, I had the following bookmarked.  I think this might be what your friend was referring to.  It is rather detailed, but you might find it helpful.

[url]http://www.islamic-awareness.org/Quran/Text/Qiraat/hafs.html[/url]
Re: Alcohol and Arabic
sofia
08/06/03 at 11:33:19
Peace, Sparrow
[quote]He said two things that I had never heard or read before and I would like people to comment and/or opine [/quote]
Glad you took the time to ask Muslims. :)

[quote]1) he said that there are different versions of the Quran, specifically that the Egyptian version is different from others. There wasn't time to ask him what he meant and I have been pondering this ever since. I have been told that all Arabic Qurans say exactly the same thing. Has anyone ever heard of this? [/quote]
Nope, never heard of/seen this. No one is capable of changing Qur'aanic text, not even a letter. It would be rejected instantly anyhow, since there are too many people who have memorized the Qur'aan, everywhere you go. If there is (even a slightly) different book some people have, it would no longer be called a Qur'aan. I haven't even seen a slightly different book from the Qur'aan, since it is inimitable. But if he means different pronunciations of the Qur'aan, yeah, that's possible, as mentioned (and of the different pronunciations, there are only 7 specific types that are permissible).

[quote]2) he said he has been told by many of his friends that the Quran does not say that one can not drink alcohol, just that excess should be avoided (don't get drunk, I guess) Now the Muslims he was refering to were not Westernized partying guys with girlfriends etc. They are family men who consider themselves "devout," they just truly believe that it is okay under Islam to have a beer or a glass of wine with dinner. Any comments? [/quote]

Just to add onto Kathy's post, the Qur'aan was not all revealed at once, but rather, in piecemeal. In some cases, there were verses that were abrogated; ie, later verses cancelled the original verse. Allah knows best, but one of the reasons some abrogated verses are still contained in the Qur'aan may be for Muslims to learn how some verses/rulings evolved. Abrogated verses are not common, but the one on alcohol consumption is probably the most well-known.

Jaahiliyyah/Pre-Islaamic "ignorance" was a time when alcohol was consumed freely. There was alcohol at every gathering. Everyone had wine in their homes, even after the revelations began. When early mention of khamr/intoxicants (and gambling) was made in the Qur'aan, it was revealed that in them is some good and some evil, and that the evils outweigh the good. Then, it was strongly suggested not to be intoxicated around the time of prayer, so as not to be drunk when praying to God. Eventually, this verse were abrogated by the commandment that alcohol (and all other intoxicants, and also gambling) was prohibited completely. The beauty of this method, is that the Muslims already had the foundations of Islaam, were already praying to God, already believed. So it was easy for them to stop drinking. They didn't need to be convinced by the evils of crime associated with drinking, by high taxes, by drunk-driving victims, by liver disease, by AA, etc. The Muslms were breaking their bottles of wine so much so, that wine was said to flow down the streets/paths in Madinah. Had the injunction been made early on during the revelations, this probably woqld not have been that easy, wAllahu A'lim/and God knows best. There's a story of Umar (ra), a companion of the Prophet and later a Khalifah, who asked God to make the verses on khamr/intoxicants clear every time something about khamr was mentioned; ie, he wanted it banned all together from the get go, masha'Allah. :)

[url=http://www.tafsir.com/default.asp?sid=2&tid=5762]The Gradual Prohibition of Khamr (Alchoholic Drink) [/url], Tafseer of Surah Baqarah (2:219) by Ibn Katheer

[url=http://www.tafsir.com/default.asp?sid=4&tid=11247]The Prohibition of Approaching Prayer When Drunk or Junub[/url], Tafseer of Surah Nisaa (4:43) by Ibn Katheer

[url=http://www.tafsir.com/default.asp?sid=5&tid=14567]Prohibiting Khamr (Intoxicants) and Maysir (Gambling), [/url]Tafseer of Surah Maa'idah (5:90-1) by Ibn Katheer

08/06/03 at 11:34:26
sofia
Re: Alcohol and Arabic
sal
08/16/03 at 19:13:50
1, The QURAN    is  only  one  version
2.Drinking  Alcohol  is  not  allowed  in islam  

;-)
08/16/03 at 19:17:06
sal


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