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Madinat al-Muslimeen Islamic Message Board
| Sahih on Witr |
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| Ember |
| 11/10/04 at 13:03:10 |
| I guess, having had some Hambali influence my experience might be different, so please keep this in mind when reading. I was following an Imam recently who prayed Witr in one go of 3 raka'as. I remember reading a HAdith where Propeht (SAW) said that we should make Witr unllike Maghrib. Is this praying as 3 in one go, a Hanafi way? |
| Re: Sahih on Witr |
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| jannah |
| 11/10/04 at 13:32:17 |
| Our Imam does that occassionally... 3 rakahs.. no at-tahiyat in between...don't know what school its from wlm, |
| Re: Sahih on Witr |
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| timbuktu |
| 11/10/04 at 22:55:46 |
| [slm] [quote author=Ember link=board=lighthouse;num=1100106191;start=0#0 date=11/10/04 at 13:03:10] Is this praying as 3 in one go, a Hanafi way?[/quote] Yes in a way it is: in the Hanafi way, the Imam says the tashahhud though, unlike what jannah's imam does at times. :) To make it different from the Maghrib, the Hanafis raise their hands in the takbeer for the third raka`ah, which normally they don't. In the Salafi or ahle Hadith way, probably also in Safi`aee, both are correct. Saying two raka`h separately, and then one rak`ah to make it witr, or saying the 3-witr in one go are also correct, but with no tashahhud at the end of the second rak`ah. |
| 11/10/04 at 23:43:37 |
| timbuktu |
| Re: Sahih on Witr |
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| Ember |
| 11/11/04 at 12:07:05 |
| [slm] I think I remember him saying Allahu Akbar a second time when we were coming up from the second but he did the entire thing just like the maghrib. Nothing was different. I had enough time to start the "attahiyath.." and come to "Ash hadu annlahilaha ilallah..", then we came up and continued. The only difference is that he did the Qunoot before the last Ruku'u. This, we don't do but I've read this being done by many. So what about that Hadith that says it should be different from the Maghrib? If doing it like Maghrib is right then is the Hadith not Hassan? Oh and another question... (As you can see I'm really paying attention at the Masjid :)) When a Quran is completed in Taraweeh, does the Imam finish it in the one before the last Raka'a and then start Tabarak allazi in the second one followed by salaams while you are standing and then ruku'u and then many sujuds? I think our Imam is Hanafi, so what are we reciting between some of these acts? Like after that salaam what do we say? I was really confused, so I finished this last Raka'a of Taraweeh completely perplexed. |
| Re: Sahih on Witr |
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| timbuktu |
| 11/11/04 at 19:17:04 |
| [slm] I don't know about the Hadith being Sahih or Hassan, but it is followed religiously by the Salafis, and Shafi`is, and I have read this in books where only the Sahih or Hassan AHadeth are quoted. The Hanafis, and followers of other Imams as well, reason that their Imams were more pious and better suited to sift through the knowledge, and hence what is attributed to them must be right. Or, at least they think, they wouldn't be questioned if they follow an Imam. In the case of witr, the Hanafis argue that raising their hands for takbeer in the third raka`ah and saying the Qunoot are sufficient for the witr to be different from Maghrib. Don't the Hanbalis say the Qunoot in witr? [quote author=Ember link=board=lighthouse;num=1100106191;start=0#3 date=11/11/04 at 12:07:05] When a Quran is completed in Taraweeh, does the Imam finish it in the one before the last Raka'a and then start Tabarak allazi in the second one followed by salaams while you are standing and then ruku'u and then many sujuds? I think our Imam is Hanafi, so what are we reciting between some of these acts? Like after that salaam what do we say? I was really confused, so I finished this last Raka'a of Taraweeh completely perplexed.[/quote] I don't know about this one. Don't recollect completing the Quran in Taraweeh behind a Hanafi Imam, but the correct way of finishing the Quran is to start over it again, so I guess this is where the practice comes from, although I don't know about salam while standing and many sujoods. Perhas Hanafis on this board can explain. Hanafis and the Soofia rest and say a particular dua after every four raka`ahs of Taraweeh. if you can find a Saheeh or Hassan Hadith for these practices, then it is good, but beware of becoming too bookish. It normally takes away the love and feeling from ibadah. |
| 11/12/04 at 05:15:45 |
| timbuktu |
| Re: Sahih on Witr |
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| bhaloo |
| 11/13/04 at 08:56:35 |
| [slm] Here a scholar, Sheikh Munajjid has addressed the issue and described the different ways of preforming witr (including the hadiths used). Question : What is the best way of offering Witr prayer?. Answer : Praise be to Allaah. Witr prayer is one of the greatest acts of worship that draw one closer to Allaah. Some of the scholars – the Hanafis – even thought that it is one of the obligatory prayers, but the correct view is that it is one of the confirmed Sunnahs (Sunnah mu’akkadah) which the Muslim should observe regularly and not neglect. Imam Ahmad (may Allaah have mercy on him) said: Whoever neglects Witr is a bad man whose testimony should not be accepted. This indicates that Witr prayer is something that is confirmed. We may sum up the manner of offering Witr prayer as follows: Its timing: It starts when a person has prayed ‘Isha’, even if it is joined to Maghrib at the time of Maghrib, and lasts until dawn begins, because the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Allaah has prescribed for you a prayer (by which He may increase your reward), which is Witr; Allaah has enjoined it for you during the time between ‘Isha’ prayer until dawn begins.” Narrated by al-Tirmidhi, 425; classed as saheeh by al-Albaani in Saheeh al-Tirmidhi. Is it better to offer this prayer at the beginning of its time or to delay it? The Sunnah indicates that if a person thinks he will be able to get up at the end of the night, it is better to delay it, because prayer at the end of the night is better and is witnessed (by the angels). But whoever fears that he will not get up at the end of the night should pray Witr before he goes to sleep, because of the hadeeth of Jaabir (may Allaah be pleased with him) who said: The Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Whoever fears that he will not get up at the end of the night, let him pray Witr at the beginning of the night, but whoever thinks that he will be able to get up at the end of the night, let him pray Witr at the end of the night, for prayer at the end of the night is witnessed (by the angels) and that is better.” Narrated by Muslim, 755. Al-Nawawi said: This is the correct view. Other ahaadeeth which speak of this topic in general terms are to be interpreted in the light of this sound, specific and clear report, such as the hadeeth, “My close friend advised me not to sleep without having prayed Witr.” This is to be understood as referring to one who is not sure that he will be able to wake up (to pray Witr at the end of the night). Sharh Muslim, 3/277. The number of rak’ahs: The minimum number of rak’ahs for Witr is one rak’ah, because the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Witr is one rak'ah at the end of the night.” Narrated by Muslim, 752. And he (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “The night prayers are two (rak’ahs) by two, but if one of you fears that dawn is about to break, let him pray one rak’ah to make what he has prayed odd-numbered.” Narrated by al-Bukhaari, 911; Muslim, 749. If a person limits himself to praying one rak’ah, then he has performed the Sunnah. But Witr may also be three or five or seven or nine. If a person prays three rak’ahs of Witr this may be done in two ways, both of which are prescribed in sharee’ah: 1 – To pray them one after another, with one tashahhud, because of the hadeeth of ‘Aa’ishah (may Allaah be pleased with her) who said: The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) used not to say the tasleem in the (first) two rakahs of Witr. According to another version: “He used to pray Witr with three rak'ahs and he did not sit except in the last of them.” Narrated by al-Nasaa’i, 3/234; al-Bayhaqi, 3/31. al-Nawawi said in al-Majmoo’ (4/7): it was narrated by al-Nasaa’i with a hasan isnaad, and by al-Bayhaqi with a saheeh isnaad. 2 – Saying the tasleem after two rak'ahs, then praying one rak’ah on its own, because of the report narrated from Ibn ‘Umar (may Allaah be pleased with him), that he used to separate the two rak'ahs from the single rak'ah with a tasleem, and he said that the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) used to do that. Narrated by Ibn Hibbaan (2435); Ibn Hajar said in al-Fath (2/482): its isnaad is qawiy (strong). But if he prays Witr with five or seven rak’ahs, then they should be continuous, and he should only recite one tashahhud in the last of them and say the tasleem, because of the report narrated by ‘Aa’ishah (may Allaah be pleased with her) who said: The Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) used to pray thirteen rak’ahs at night, praying five rak’ahs of Witr, in which he would not sit except in the last rak’ah. Narrated by Muslim, 737. And it was narrated that Umm Salamah (may Allaah be pleased with her) said: The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) used to pray Witr with five or seven (rak’ahs) and he did not separate between them with any salaam or words. Narrated by Ahmad, 6/290; al-Nasaa’i, 1714. al-Nawawi said: Its isnaad is jayyid. Al-Fath al-Rabbaani, 2/297. and it was classed as saheeh by al-Albaani in Saheeh al-Nasaa’i. If he prays Witr with nine rak’ahs, then they should be continuous and he should sit to recite the tashahhud in the eighth rak'ah, then stand up and not say the tasleem, then he should recite the tashahhud in the ninth rak’ah and then say the tasleem. It was narrated in Muslim (746) from ‘Aa’ishah (may Allaah be pleased with her) that the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) used to pray nine rak’ahs in which he did not sit except in the eighth, when he would remember Allaah, praise Him and call upon Him, then he would get up and not say the tasleem, and he would stand up and pray the ninth (rak’ah), then he would sit and remember Allaah and praise Him and call upon Him, then he would say a tasleem that we could hear. If he prayed Witr with eleven rak’ahs, he would say the tasleem after each two rak’ahs, then pray one rak’ah at the end. The less perfect way of praying Witr and what is to be recited therein: The less perfect way in Witr is to pray two rak'ahs and say the tasleem, then to pray one rak’ah and say the tasleem. It is permissible to say one tasleem, but one should say one tashahhud not two, as stated above. In the first rak’ah one should recite Sabbih isma rabbika al-‘a’la (“Glorify the name of your Lord, the Most High” – Soorat al-A’la 87). In the second one should recite Soorat al-Kaafiroon (109), and in the third Soorat al-Ikhlaas (112). Al-Nasaa’i (1729) narrated that Ubayy ibn Ka’b said: The Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) used to recite in Witr Sabbih isma rabbika al-‘a’la (“Glorify the name of your Lord, the Most High” – Soorat al-A’la 87), Qul yaa ayyuha’l-kaafiroon (“Say: O disbeliever…” – Soorat al-Kaafiroon 109) and Qul Huwa Allaahu ahad (“Say: He is Allaah, the One” – Soorat al-Ikhlaas 112). Classed as saheeh by al-Albaani in Saheeh al-Nasaa’i. All these ways of offering Witr prayer have been mentioned in the Sunnah, but the best way is not to stick to one particular way; rather one should do it one way one time and another way another time, so that one will have done all the Sunnahs. And Allaah knows best. http://63.175.194.25/index.php?ln=eng&ds=qa&lv=browse&QR=46544&dgn=4 |
| Re: Sahih on Witr |
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| Ember |
| 11/15/04 at 11:19:41 |
| [slm] Jazaka Allahu khair Bhaloo. Timbuktu- Yes, according to the Hamballi school of thougtht Qunoot is prayed in Witr. Usually after rising from ruku'u. I have to disagree that getting into all this rules and regulations takes away from the love of the ibada. One, it is driven by the love of doing the ibada well. Two, we could be blamed if we don't attempt to seek the best possible way to perform the ibada. Allah is most merciful oft forgiving so, I know that mistakes will be forgiven but I don't want to be amongst the negligent. Insha Allah, if we seek the information and thus him, we will be in a better position. |
| Re: Sahih on Witr |
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| timbuktu |
| 11/15/04 at 11:59:29 |
| [slm] Thanks, brother bhaloo. I can always count on you to bring the authentic view in detail. :) sis Ember: yes, you are right that we must seek the correct and the best way, out of love for Allah (swt) and His last prophet [saw] I found this becoming an obsession, and someone else confirmed it was happening to him, too. Then I read a similar effect by ibne Qayyim, and he recommended reading up on the lives of the Companions and the Salafe Swaliheen to bring back the love. I have seen too much strictness and statement of laws and rules with an arrogance, as if bombarding the non-observer or non-conformist with bricks and stones, rather than talking with humility and love. I think also that there are exceptions to rules, or more than one way of doing things, yet people sometimes become very strict in whatever they know. :( Other than the above, I again reiterate your point that seeking knowledge to do things correctly is the way. :) We must do it out of humility in front of Allah (swt), and of love for Him and His creation. |
| 11/15/04 at 12:12:15 |
| timbuktu |
| Re: Sahih on Witr |
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| gift |
| 11/22/04 at 11:15:44 |
| [slm] A slightly off-topic question. What if one intends to pray tahajjud, and then pray witr after this, but does not wake up until Fajr time? As I understand it, the Witr prayer is Sunnah Mu'akkadah therefore there is no qadhaa. However, I have heard of some people who make qadhaa for witr prayer? [wlm] |
| Re: Sahih on Witr |
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| timbuktu |
| 11/23/04 at 13:03:56 |
| [slm] sis Attiya I don't have a reference to what I have to say on your question:- I read somewhere that if one misses the witr at night, one should say it in the morning, the differnce would be that one would not say an odd number of raka`ah, but two raka`ah. Brother bhaloo has a very sound habit of coming up with the right referenced Q & A. Maybe he will oblige us here once again. |
| Re: Sahih on Witr |
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| faisalsb |
| 11/29/04 at 22:42:17 |
| [wlm] Well Witr and two rakah sunnah before fajr prayer is a sunnah what Holy Prophet [saw] never missed and He [saw] even didn't leave it during travelling so usually their status is considered as wajab which is in between sunnah and farz. So we are supposed to offer qadha and atleast from one another hadith I know we are also supposed to perform qadha of all Sunnah Moqda as once Holy Prophet [saw] came from Asr prayer and he offered two rakah sunnah. One of the umm-ul-momneen asked about those two rakah and Holy Prophet [saw] replied those are two sunnah raka for Duhar prayer what he missed due to some guests came to him........ Walla hu alam |
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