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Madinat al-Muslimeen Islamic Message Board
| Unislamic to feel this way? |
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| Shahida |
| 11/23/04 at 05:42:52 |
| [slm] I know there is *no* copyright in Islam, but is it right to *steal* someone's words, without saying where these words came from? And what about acknowledging someone else's input, for example, if someone not only helped you to edit your articles, but basically wrote paragraphs, without you changing it? I am not talking about monetary acknowledgment...a simple, "written with the help of so-&-so"... Is it *unislamic* of me to feel cheated if someone did this to me, on several occasions? And these feelings of cheating are making me more apprehensive in helping her anymore? *For the good of mankind, and for the Sake of Allah alone* just doesnt get me through this month in and month out anymore in this situation. Wasalam Shahida :( |
| 11/23/04 at 06:12:49 |
| Shahida |
| Re: Unislamic to feel this way? |
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| timbuktu |
| 11/23/04 at 09:10:54 |
| [slm] First of all, I do not accept that there is no copyright in Islam. I would like to know where that comes from. no it isn't unIslamic to feel the way you feel. It is quite natural. Unfortunately, there is a tendency among many to avoid acknowledgment. I do not understand the reason for it. One way is to forget the good deeds as we do them, and ask Allah (swt) to grant hidaya to the person concerned. We try not to feel upset as we are denied our due for our efforts. Then our good deeds will be rewarded by Allah, and who can reward better than Him? :) Another way is to explain oneself to the person concerned the Islamic position on this. This is to make him/her a better Muslim and a better human being. We still take our personal rewards out of the equation. We get rewarded for that in the hereafter for this, too, but the niyyah must be pure. If the person gives us credit, that is a bonus. It may reduce the reward in the hereafter if the niyyah changes for this world. A third is to seek our due recognition in this world, and ask for it. One may or may not get the reward here. Depending on whom we ask for our due, how we pursue that right, what is our niyyah for the Hereafter, the rewards may be reduced even further. All three are Islamic options, with the right niyyah, and the right methodology, but with the degree of reward in the Hereafter being different. The pick is ours. If we look upon our deeds as not ours, but from Allah's tawfeeq; if we seek rewards only from Allah (swt), but figure out a way to bring an improvement in persons who deny us our rights; if the niyyah is for recognition and rewards from Allah (swt) alone, we cannot imagine what we will get! After Islam had spread in the lands of Iraq, Syria, Egypt and Persia, the Sahaba (ra) were worried their good deeds have already been rewarded in this world, and that they may not have anything left for the Hereafter. ____________________________________________________________________ raabana atena hasanatanwwa fil akhirati hasanatanwwa qina adhabanNar Are you sure everything you have is deserved? Have you thanked Allah (swt) enough? Do you want all your rewards in this world? Count your blessings. Seek rewrads from Allah (swt). Yes, even the recognition of your contribution. If you don't get it here, something far better will be reserved for you in the Aakhirah. In short, make your niyyah for Allah's pleasure alone. Do strive for your rights, including credits, but whatever you get, or do not get, stay thankful to Allah. You never know what good He has is store for you. wa assalaam |
| 01/26/05 at 17:37:42 |
| timbuktu |
| http://www.jannah.org/board/attachments/rabbana_aatina.bmp |
| rabbana_aatina.bmp |
| Re: Unislamic to feel this way? |
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| Bangachi |
| 11/23/04 at 10:37:12 |
I certainly hope it wasn't me...you wrote a reply about losing my Iman that inspired me to write to a sister who experienced something similar and I may have unintentally shared your wise advice to my Post Losing My Iman. If it was me please accept my apology, but remember when someone copies you that is the greatest compliment of all, it means your wisdom spread to others and you should feel flattered that your words had a powerful impact on anothers life. Thats a great achievement Masha Allah sister that others wish to follow in your path. Wa Salaam |
| NS |
| Re: Unislamic to feel this way? |
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| Bangachi |
| 11/23/04 at 10:51:53 |
| Timbuktu you helped me in my post losing my Iman. The above post blew me away. What insight...after all the words of the prophet Muhammad pbuh were spread word of mouth ...can you imagine if he became insulted that someone "stole" his words and advice. I don't know perhaps it would have been decent for the person to acknowledge the sister...but either way she may have helped someone...what a wonderful feeling! That's why I come here...Unselfish people have read and replied to my personal problems and many times I got my answer...or at least felt like somebody out there could relate to my pain, joy, or whatever. Recently, I posted a reply to a revert like myself who was alienated by friends and family too... it felt good that I could find someone to relate to my exact problem and in addition share the advice that other unselfish sister and brothers gave to me. |
| Re: Unislamic to feel this way? |
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| Bangachi |
| 11/23/04 at 11:03:00 |
| Oh...I forgot Timbuktu ......In Shallah you have great health, a long life, a blessed family, and a spectacular Haj! I can't wait to hear how great it will be Wa Salaam |
| Re: Unislamic to feel this way? |
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| Ember |
| 11/23/04 at 12:32:38 |
| [slm] Sister Shahida, I am so sorry you are in this situation. My work is in research, so this happens a lot. It leaves a very bad taste in the mouth. I know that asking for recognition is the 'right' thing to do, but it gets a little messy. I don't like confrontations so I don't. I usually battle it by working harder and getting the recognition from my own work and try to appease myself for the lack of recognition due to my helping someone. This might not work out for you. It just helps me after many failed trials and endless venting to my close friend. :) This takes the burden from the heart plus keeps it from festering. Insha Allah I hope your work is rewarded in this world AND the next. (fid dunya hasana wa fil akhirathi hasana) TIMBUKTU - Been going through quite a lot of struggles, getting through life and holding on to Islam. Not as experienced as you but, I am a bit of an old soul, you might say. Your experiences shared here have been very good at motivating me, to keep at it. Jazaka Allahu Khair. May Allah accept your Hajj - Ameen. |
| Re: Unislamic to feel this way? |
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| Shahida |
| 11/24/04 at 01:06:05 |
| [slm] Uncle Timbuktu:) Alhamdulillah, when I hear your story, that is reconfirmation of Allah's Mercy! May Allah swt keep you steadfast, and make everything easy for you, ameen! I agree...this has been going on for a long time, and I have spoken to my family, and everyone says "You are doing this for the Sake of Allah swt, that should be reward enough!"...and wallahi for a long time it *was*! But when I explain to her that it is only *right* to acknowledge that she had help, she agrees, promises to put my name somewhere, and when I see the articles in print, there is no "Shahida" written anywhere. I think this is a form of cheating, leaving people who read her articles with the false impression that she has 100% command of the English language, when in actual fact she does not:( Also, when they ask her to speak somewhere, I have to help with the speeches too. Like I said, it is not only a matter of editing, but I put a lot of myself into the writing as well. Maybe that's my mistake. maybe I should just correct her style grammatically, and send it off without major adjustments? But then I feel like I would not be doing my best, and thats an awful feeling as well. What makes this worse for me, is that in the past she had someone else doing this for her. I still have no idea why they dont help her anymore. But she *always* recognised them in her writing. So does the fact that I am her sister in Islam, and not a non-Muslim, matter? That she thinks she should have more respect for them, than me? cuz I am a Muslima, and should understand that she feels no need to recognise my input? I hate feeling like someone is taking advantage of me?? Anyway, I am not gonna brood about this anymore. There are more important things to do. I will speak to her one more time, and take it from there. Doing something for the Sake of Allah alone, should be enough for me! ::) InshaAllah, I need to keep that in mind. Let me get my Niyaah in order, and I am sure that everything else will become easier inshaAllah!!! :) Thanks for the advise, mashaAllah. Salam Shahida :-) |
| 11/24/04 at 03:15:45 |
| Shahida |
| Re: Unislamic to feel this way? |
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| georger |
| 12/17/04 at 01:23:10 |
| [quote author=Shahida link=board=madrasa;num=1101202973;start=0#0 date=11/23/04 at 05:42:52] [slm] I know there is *no* copyright in Islam, but is it right to *steal* someone's words, without saying where these words came from? And what about acknowledging someone else's input, for example, if someone not only helped you to edit your articles, but basically wrote paragraphs, without you changing it? I am not talking about monetary acknowledgment...a simple, "written with the help of so-&-so"... Is it *unislamic* of me to feel cheated if someone did this to me, on several occasions? And these feelings of cheating are making me more apprehensive in helping her anymore? *For the good of mankind, and for the Sake of Allah alone* just doesnt get me through this month in and month out anymore in this situation. Wasalam Shahida :( [/quote] All things belong to God. It irks me when people claim anything to truly be their property when they don't even own their own lives and protect them from that final rest we must all take. Anyway.....all things belong to God. Including all good words and meanings. As long as you are not claiming to have first written it, I can't see any issue at all regarding quoting someone else's writing so long as you are clear on the origin of the quote. Just my 2¢ worth... |
| Re: Unislamic to feel this way? |
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| se7en |
| 12/21/04 at 12:48:03 |
| as salaamu alaykum wa rahmatullah, your writing is your property. if someone usurps some property of yours, it's natural to feel that this is an injustice. while in most cases it's commendable to forgo your rights - to choose mercy over justice, and to forgive the other party though you are actually in the right - this is certainly not a requirement, and it is not unIslamic to feel that justice should be done. in this situation, I think there is some miscommunication between you and the other party. perhaps you are contributing a great deal to these pieces, while she thinks you are only 'editing', because that is what she originally asked of you. I think you should clarify your stance with her, about what she really wants from you here, and what you are willing to contribute, and on what terms. I've head this statement before, that "there is no copyright in Islam". What does that mean? that it's a concept that was not in existence in the time of our prophet [saw] and the two successive generations after him? okay.. but does that mean it's unIslamic? No, I don't think so. I think this idea is often misused to justify inappropriate behavior, such as plagiarism, the illegal copying of Islamic books and tapes, etc which deprives the original authors of the benefits they rightly deserve. and that is a dhulm, especially if the author/artist's livelihood is dependent on that. w'Allahu a'lam. wasalaamu alaykum wa rahmatullah |
| 12/21/04 at 13:02:12 |
| se7en |
| Re: Unislamic to feel this way? |
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| georger |
| 12/22/04 at 22:23:13 |
| [quote author=se7en link=board=madrasa;num=1101202973;start=0#8 date=12/21/04 at 12:48:03]as salaamu alaykum wa rahmatullah, your writing is your property.[/quote] If all good and beautiful things belong to God - including us - how can we feel any injustice? Sounds more like human selfishness in action to me. Just my 2¢ worth. |
| Re: Unislamic to feel this way? |
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| jannah |
| 12/23/04 at 00:16:45 |
| georger if someone stole something of yours that is beautiful would you think it's ok??? because ultimately everything belongs to God right? it just isn't right... to exploit and profit off of others is not right |
| Re: Unislamic to feel this way? |
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| bhaloo |
| 12/23/04 at 01:50:01 |
| [slm] Hmmm, this is an interesting topic, the issue of copyrights and plajarism. [quote] I think this idea is often misused to justify inappropriate behavior, such as plagiarism, the illegal copying of Islamic books and tapes, etc which deprives the original authors of the benefits they rightly deserve. and that is a dhulm, especially if the author/artist's livelihood is dependent on that. [/quote] What are your thoughts on these people that translate someone's work into another language and then add their own commentary to it, in some cases, some deviant commentary that takes away from the beauty of the original text in its own native language. I perosnally think that this is a great injustice done by the translator. And furthermore, did these people ask the original authors of their works if they could translate their works? When we copy and past hadith from sahih bukhari, should we be paying someone royalties? When we go to a site and download some mp3 of a qari, should we be paying him? Should we pay the person that leads the prayer and the one that gives the adhaan (sort of like how a singer is paid at concerts)? If not, where do we draw the line. |
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