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Madinat al-Muslimeen Islamic Message Board
| Surah IX |
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| AbdulMuhsee |
| 01/17/05 at 09:23:56 |
| Assalemu Alaikum Why doesn't Surah Al-Bara'at start out with In the name of Allah, The Benificient, The Merciful like the rest of the surahs? |
| Re: Surah IX |
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| chocolate |
| 01/17/05 at 12:57:38 |
| [slm] Yes I was just thinking about that also. |
| Re: Surah IX |
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| Laila_Y_A |
| 01/17/05 at 14:50:22 |
| [slm] Here is a portion of the Introduction to Surah 9 from Ali's translation of the Qur'an: "This is the only Surah to which the usual formula of 'Bismillah' is not prefixed. It was among the last of the Surahs revealed, and though the Prophet had directed that it should follow Surah 8, it was not clear whether it was to form a separate Surah or only a part of Surah 8. It is now treated as a separate Surah, but the 'Bismillah' is not prefixed to it, as there is no warrant for supposing that the Prophet used the 'Bismillah' before it in his recitation of the Qur'an. The Surah is known under many names: the most commonly used are (1) 'Al Tawbah[Repentance], with reference to 9:104 and (2) 'Bara'ah' [The Disavowal], the opening word of the Surah." I hope this helps shed some light on the question. [slm] :-) Laila |
| Re: Surah IX |
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| AbdulMuhsee |
| 01/17/05 at 19:11:11 |
| Assalemu Alaikum Hmm... so this shouldn't be a separate surah? or.... i'm confused. Also, i'm confused about certain ayats within... 9:23 - O you who believe, take not your fathers and your brothers for friends if they love disbelief above faith. And whoever of you takes them for friends, such are the wrongdoers. What does this mean? It could go back to the whole mistranslation thing for friends, if so, what does it really mean!? And 9:29 - Fight those who believe not in Allah, nor the Last Day, nor forbid that which Allah and His Messenger have forbidden, nor follow the Religion of Truth, out of those who have been given the Book, until they pay the tax in acknowledgement of superiority and they are in a state of subjection. Do the enemies, after they are defeated, have to pay some sort of tribute? And uh... what does subjection mean, lol |
| Re: Surah IX |
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| Nisa |
| 01/17/05 at 19:26:44 |
| [slm] Brother, you might find this useful: http://www.tafsir.com/default.asp?sid=9&tid=20707 For the tafsir of the entire surah: http://www.tafsir.com/Default.asp Pray this helps inshaAllah [wlm] |
| Re: Surah IX |
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| AbdulMuhsee |
| 01/17/05 at 20:23:30 |
| assalemu alaikum whoa.. what i got from that tafsir was that the idol-worshippers will be given a little bit longer before they either convert or are slaughtered, i don't get it. |
| Re: Surah IX |
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| jannah |
| 01/17/05 at 23:11:01 |
| AbdulMuhsee, that seems to be the gist of your posts here... you keep coming back to the same "points" and use the same verses out of context to boot! maybe you should take some time and study Islam a bit more to understand what it's really about instead of coming to some wack conclusions about the surah there are different opinions about why that surah does not have bismillah... one is that it is speaking about a very harsh topic that of the hypocrites who are worse than those who deny faith...or two that it was supposed to be part of the surah before or actually we really don't know... there is a wisdom to it that we can only surmise 9:23 is about taking disbelievers as your awliyah (often mistranslated as friends, but really means protectors or forging alliances with), so God is telling us not to take disbelievers to be our protectors because they have their own agenda and eventually it comes out to the detriment of the believers. this is not to say the muslims cannot enter into treaties or work on things together, it is saying that it is quite stupid to take as protectors people who are really working against you. 9:29 is about opening the lands of Islam, once they are any people that live in there are protected by law. they have a right to practice their own religion in freedom and can even have their own court system to abide by their own laws. they do not have to pay zakat (2.5% as muslims do), but they do have to pay a tax to be in the muslim state.. i mean we all pay income tax so i don't see how it's such a big issue so this is really injustice to those two ayahs....to take them out of context and try to explain them to you when there are papers and books and volumes written about Islam's fair treatment of non-Muslims in a Muslim state along with historical fact and proof, but anyway i hope you get the idea |
| Re: Surah IX |
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| asad |
| 01/18/05 at 10:38:49 |
| wasalam. it is a intersting subject and forgive if my answer is brief. basically the surah is talking about war on the kaufar yes,and i belive in the infinite wisdom of Allah swt that Allah swt didnt want to begin with the most compassionate the most merciful as this doesnt go with the topic of jihad,sorry if that does`nt make sence and this is my view please dont take this as the only answer,surely Allah is the all wise the all knowing.jazkallah |
| Re: Surah IX |
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| AbdulMuhsee |
| 01/18/05 at 18:27:56 |
| Assalemu Alaikum Hmm... I think i'm beginning to understand the surah better, but there is one thing that i don't get yet at the very beginning. It says to slay the idolators if you have a treaty with them and they have betrayed it, then it says if they repent, keep up prayer, and pay the poor-due, to leave their way free. Then it says if any one of them seeks the Prophet's [saw] protection, that he must give it to them. I can understand why the idolators deserve death if they have betrayed the muslim ummah, but what does it mean when it says that they must keep up prayer? Do they have to convert then? Why wouldn't they be allowed to practice whatever they wanted so long as they payed the poor-rate? |
| Re: Surah IX |
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| jannah |
| 01/18/05 at 19:18:12 |
| Again ur taking the verses out of context.. the verses were revealed for specific reasons and context you can't just take it out and make your own religion based upon it. That's an injustice to Islam. Here is a nice little summary about your questions: Q. Aren't there some verses of the Qur'an that condone "killing the infidel"? A. The Qur'an commands Muslims to stick up for themselves in a defensive battle -- i.e. if an enemy army attacks, then Muslims are to fight against that army until they stop their aggression. All of the verses that speak about fighting/war in the Qur'an are in this context. There are some specific verses that are very often "snipped" out of context, either by those trying to malign the faith, or by misguided Muslims themselves who wish to justify their aggressive tactics. For example, one verse (in its snipped version) reads: "slay them wherever you catch them" (Qur'an 2:191). But who is this referring to? Who are "they" that this verse discusses? The preceding and following verses give the correct context: "Fight in the cause of God those who fight you, but do not transgress limits; for God loves not transgressors. And slay them wherever ye catch them, and turn them out from where they have turned you out; for tumult and oppression are worse than slaughter; but fight them not at the Sacred Mosque, unless they (first) fight you there; but if they fight you, slay them. Such is the reward of those who suppress faith. But if they cease, God is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful. And fight them on until there is no more tumult or oppression, and there prevails justice and faith in God; but if they cease, let there be no hostility except to those who practise oppression" (2:190-193). It is clear from the context that these verses are discussing a defensive war, when a Muslim community is attacked without reason, oppressed and prevented from practicing their faith. In these circumstances, permission is given to fight back -- but even then Muslims are instructed not to transgress limits, and to cease fighting as soon as the attacker gives up. Even in these circumstances, Muslim are only to fight directly against those who are attacking them, not innocent bystanders or non-combatants. Another similar verse can be found in chapter 9, verse 5 -- which in its snipped, out of context version could read: "fight and slay the pagans wherever ye find them, and seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem (of war)." Again, the preceding and following verses give the context. This verse was revealed during a historical period when the small Muslim community had entered into treaties with neighboring tribes (Jewish, Christian, and pagan). Several of the pagan tribes had violated the terms of their treaty, secretly aiding an enemy attack against the Muslim community. The verse directly before this one instructs the Muslims to continue to honor treaties with anyone who has not since betrayed them, because fulfilling agreements is considered a righteous action. Then the verse continues, that those who have violated the terms of the treaty have declared war, so fight them... (as quoted above). Directly after this permission to fight, the same verse continues, "but if they repent, and establish regular prayers and practise regular charity, then open the way for them... for God is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful." The subsequent verses instruct the Muslims to grant asylum to any member of the pagan tribe/army who asks for it, and again reminds that "as long as these stand true to you, stand ye true to them: for God loves the righteous." Any verse that is quoted out of context misses the whole point of the message of the Qur'an. Nowhere in the Qur'an can be found support for indiscriminate slaughter, the killing of non-combatants, or murder of innocent persons in 'payback' for another people's alleged crimes. The Islamic teachings on this subject can be summed up in the following verses (Qur'an 60:7-8): "It may be that God will grant love (and friendship) between you and those whom ye (now) hold as enemies. For God has power (over all things), and God is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful. God does not forbid you, with regard to those who fight you not for (your) faith nor drive you out of your homes, from dealing kindly and justly with them: for God loves those who are just." |
| NS |
| 01/18/05 at 19:20:41 |
| jannah |
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